CurtisWalker
Well-Known Member
Nice work, the pheasants thank you!
Coyotes have a net positive effect on pheasant populations. Just throwing ot out there.
Daver
PMA Member
Really, I was not aware of that. Is there a study or research available that explains that?
CurtisWalker
Well-Known Member
I just know it's a topic we are discussing in community ecology class right now. Looks like TH got a post for it too.
Daver
PMA Member
I don't want to hijack the original thread, but I read the article linked by TH and I would not interpret that as supporting the idea that coyotes have a net positive effect on pheasant populations.
HorseDoctor
PMA Member
Correct!!! I've got a flight pen with pheasants for dog training & coyote prints around it are fairly common as are trail cam pix of them carrying birds. In the overall scheme of things, they may not do the damage to pheasant population that the nest predators (coons, possums & skunks mostly) do. Maybe a fox (or bobcat) will get more adult pheasants & they compete with yotes for territory, but I'll take a yote outta the picture any time I get a chance. I will guarantee that yotes will also take an adult turkey if the number of times they've rushed my decoys is any indication.
In any instance, there is no doubt they raise hell with fawns as well as other young or debilitated deer. Whack em all!!!! The bleeding hearts will step in & save them before they go extinct (just like they tried to do with prairie dogs)...
Coyotes eat phesants, I eat pheasants. I only kill a handful of male pheasants during a certain time of year. Coyotes will eat them year round along with eggs/ chicks. Coyotes have a negative affect on all game animals I want to eat. So therefore I will kill them every given chance. If I can sell one for 30 bucks that covers the cost of a deer or turkey tag. That's my way of dumbing down the killing of coyotes
Feral cats get the same treatment
Feral cats get the same treatment
CurtisWalker
Well-Known Member
I'm fine with killing coyotes. Just wanted to say they have a net positive effect on the population. Yes, they have a direct negative effect on them. But the indirect factors create more of a positive. This is why many conservation efforts fail because people can't open their minds to new things and look at the whole picture.
Daver
PMA Member
Curtis - I think I am open to new ideas, but I am having a hard time grasping your point. You appear to contradict yourself by stating that coyotes have a direct negative effect, but then stating that there are indirect factors that create a positive. What exactly are the indirect factors and how do we know that in aggregate they outweigh the negative factors?
LYON
PMA Member
I'm hearing it like this. Let's say a fox will kill two pheasants a year and a coyote will only kill one. Both have a direct negative affect on the pheasants. But...
1. Kill the coyote, the fox lives on and kills two pheasants.
2. Let the coyote live. He kills the fox and a pheasant.
I can understand the idea behind it, but there would have to be an awful lot of good data to convince me that it offsets itself enough to merit having coyotes around. But for me, I care more about deer than pheasants, so bang goes the gun every time I have a coyote in range.
1. Kill the coyote, the fox lives on and kills two pheasants.
2. Let the coyote live. He kills the fox and a pheasant.
I can understand the idea behind it, but there would have to be an awful lot of good data to convince me that it offsets itself enough to merit having coyotes around. But for me, I care more about deer than pheasants, so bang goes the gun every time I have a coyote in range.
Daver
PMA Member
Thanks guys, I can see what you are trying to say better now, although I am not sure yet that the math has been proven. Certainly, coons, skunks and possums are tough on nests and if any given critter finds one nest per year they essentially kill 6-10 pheasants in one swipe, so to speak. But I am not sure how many coons, skunks and possums a coyote will kill per year.
I also know that coyotes will hunt and catch pheasants, I have watched them do it a couple of times. Interesting stuff.
I also know that coyotes will hunt and catch pheasants, I have watched them do it a couple of times. Interesting stuff.
CurtisWalker
Well-Known Member
Sorry, Daver, didn't really know how to put it in words. My professor said we will be talking about it more so if I get a study or something I will share it.
Fishbonker
Life Member
'Yotes kill feral cats therefore the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
Actually, around here I am over run by possums and coons with tons of coyote sign. So either there is enough food to go around or the 'yotes in the neighborhood are too high class to eat God's abomination or coon.
I also understand the point about net gain but color me skeptical. One of those empirical versus proven things.
Actually, around here I am over run by possums and coons with tons of coyote sign. So either there is enough food to go around or the 'yotes in the neighborhood are too high class to eat God's abomination or coon.
I also understand the point about net gain but color me skeptical. One of those empirical versus proven things.
Iowa_Buckeye
Active Member
An example of a coyote having an indirect positive effect on the pheasant population.
I care more about the impacts on the deer population vs. pheasant though.
I care more about the impacts on the deer population vs. pheasant though.
Fishbonker
Life Member
Thanks for sharing the pic.
That coon looks pretty stiff.
Also remember Mother Nature tries to conserve energy when ever possible.So every creature tries to kill and eat what will take the least amount of energy to do so. Sort of a net energy gain. I can't imagine the fight a coon would put up against a coyote causing the coyote to expend a lot of energy not to mention the risk of injury.
That coon looks pretty stiff.
Also remember Mother Nature tries to conserve energy when ever possible.So every creature tries to kill and eat what will take the least amount of energy to do so. Sort of a net energy gain. I can't imagine the fight a coon would put up against a coyote causing the coyote to expend a lot of energy not to mention the risk of injury.
I'm for all predator control, do all I can; trap and hunt.
I also know coyotes self regulate their population. They do this by litter size. If plenty of food they have large litters, also if no food they respond with small litters.
So in theory the more you kill the bigger litters they have!
The only way to control is to kill them all!!! You all better work harder to do that! Lol Good luck
I also know coyotes self regulate their population. They do this by litter size. If plenty of food they have large litters, also if no food they respond with small litters.
So in theory the more you kill the bigger litters they have!
The only way to control is to kill them all!!! You all better work harder to do that! Lol Good luck
Tim Hull
PMA Member
I believe Hoffman is correct from the studies I have read. You can't kill every coyote, but you can impact the population so that in the Spring more fawns survive when they are at their weakest, so you can have an impact, but there will always be coyotes in the current hunting that we allow.
