HF 210 Straight wall rifle

Discussion in 'Legislative Forum' started by Fishbonker, Feb 6, 2017.

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Do you support HF 210 rifles using straight wall ammunition?

  1. Yes

  2. No

  3. Neutral

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  1. Sligh1

    Sligh1 Well-Known Member

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    I may have a different outlook. I'm not necessarily ONLY responding to the word rifle or a new bullet.... I'm responding, more-so, to the big picture.... Every year we get a NEW WEAPON proposed, a change to our seasons, more time for more deer to be killed and more people with more lethal weapons out killing them. Every year it's a Liberalizing of the season. It's RARELY, IF EVER, THE OTHER WAY AROUND.... Shortening the seasons, etc. My point is this.... The season is basically 4 months long now, that's 1/3rd the frigin year deer are being shot at. You have youth season, bow, early ML, shotgun 1, shotgun 2, late ML. That's allowing: shotguns, crossbows during late ML & for senior & disabled, ML's, bows and pistols. That's a total of 5 weapons currently. That is 6 different deer seasons across 4 months. How on earth can a rationale and sane person not think that's enough????? If you don't have enough killing choices, opportunities and time to go hunt deer in Iowa with 4 months, 5 weapons & 6 deer seasons - it is NOT the job of the legislature & DNR to solve your time/weapon problem. The other main point.... That's NOT THEIR GOAL!!!! The goal is NOT to give you more choices!!! This is coming from Special Interests who pass this garbage to the Legislatures (who they either lobby or donate to) to push to the public with the motive of, for example: killing off the "worthless & costly deer" or to "sell more products" (Crossbows, tags, rifles, guns, WHATEVER). That's the big picture folks need to understand!!!!!
    Again folks, SMALL DEER HERD, 5% timber in our state, NR's owning probaby a HUGE % of the ground in the timbered part of states, access being extremely hard right now, getting a buck to maturity increasingly difficult. Do we want to play games with our troubled system as it sits? Do we really want to take regulation changes every year from Special Interests? I sure don't. Let's see a bill to TAKE AWAY one of the 6 deer seasons!!!! How about instead of 4 months, all seasons are shortened by 15%? How about if they proposed a one buck rule? I'm not saying I'm for all these - I'm pointing out, we rarely, if ever see Conservative & CONSERVING laws that better our deer herd. Leave the frigin regulations the heck alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
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  3. gunrunr

    gunrunr Life Member

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    Totally Agree Skip - special interests are going to eat up our deer herd and eventually will limit our hunting opportunities
    Next up they will be asking to let us use Air-bows, air rifles and slingshots to kill deer
    Practically anything goes in Iowa the way it is - lets not make it worse.

    If you dont see the argument that this will legalize more powerful weapons then think about how it will also legalize less powerful weapons.
    A $269 HiPoint Carbine in .45 ACP would also be legalized - I foresee people buying these because they are cheap and fun to shoot but in reality are not a good choice for hunting whitetails.
    I think we will have way more wounded deer running around escaping the "weekend warrior" that only hunts during shotgun season and really has no good understanding of gun safety skills and woodsmanship.
    I think we all know several people that fit this category.

    People claiming these guns are needed to allow children who are "recoil sensitive" to hunt have obviously never tried a muzzleloader loaded down to 50-60 grains of powder and a 200 grain saboted bullet.
    My 10 year old daughter shot her first deer this year with just such a gun (costing less than $200) and it performed flawlessly - clean ethical kill at 52 yds. using a weapon with almost no recoil.
     
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  4. breckhawk

    breckhawk Member

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    I definitely see your points guys...and they are valid. Idiots are going to be idiots regardless of the legislation. The fact is we already know that pistol versions of these things are legal...so people are already using them. It's not really anything 'new'. As far as the Hi Point Carbine these people can already buy a 45 cal hi point pistol and pop off as well.

    If they were to allow ANY NEW cartridges in this bill or extend a special season for it....I would be completely against it.

    They aren't though.

    We also have to understand that we will ALWAYS have to make concessions. Times change. Deer hunters have to adapt. Fight the bills that are going to be really bad. This one IMO is just not one of them. We agree to disagree :)
     
  5. Oct-Lull

    Oct-Lull Active Member

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    I see Ohio allows this with a 3 shell limit unless I'm mistaken. Not for this at all but I would support a shell limit at 3. I mean they allow smokeless muzzleloaders? What's the point, just one shot but 300 yd range?
     
  6. arm

    arm Active Member

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    Maybe a pointless comment but I'm on on the pot checking in on IW. I don't know hardly anything about guns but whatever direction we need to go to limit the amount of dead and non recovered deer during shotgun season...I'm all for (not 100% related to this thread but all I can think of ok). So my point, thanks for you guys that give actual detail behind your responses so I can learn and spread the word in an educated way.
     
  7. meyeri

    meyeri PMA Member

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    I'm gonna be the devils advocate here. No offense, but there is little difference between a 20 gauge .58 round and the rounds that they are proposing. When broken down, a plastic shell casing is the only difference between what we constitute a shotgun and a rifle.

    If guys want to they can currently add magazine/tube extenders and elevate their capacity. Either one you can pop off a high amount of rounds in a hurry. I actually wouldn't mind it. No more paying $13 bucks for 5 rounds of accutips and you essentially have the same ballistics, same rifled barrel and same magazine capacity if you so desire.
    On the negative side, I do agree that proposals like this have the opportunity to open the flood gates for further changes and modification. I also think allowing use of these during LM is a terrible idea.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2017
  8. 4DABUCKS

    4DABUCKS Active Member

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    special interests are going to eat up our deer herd and eventually will limit our hunting opportunities
    Next up they will be asking to let us use Air-bows, air rifles and slingshots to kill deer
    Practically anything goes in Iowa the way it is - lets not make it worse.JNRBRONC said: ↑
    It appears the sky is falling. ;):D
    Sometimes it falls a little bit at a time and if you are not paying attention, it can be beyond repair before you know it.
    Tuesday at 4:57 PM ReportUnlikeReply
    You aOn the negative side, I do agree that proposals like this have the opportunity to open the flood gates for further changes and modification. I also think allowing use of these during LM is a terrible idea.

    Right now more than ever in our state we need to choose very wisely on our new regulations being presented yr to yr. Ask the guys who hunt in the bottom 3rd of the state about how quick your hunting can change. In 2012 and 2013 we had big ehd outbreaks that in some areas killed more that 70% of our mature bucks as well as several does. (Sick feeling walking up on a pond with a dozen deer in/around it including 3 mature bucks) I know every yr we have a bit of ehd but fortunately not every yr is like those two yes.
    Now talk to those who hunt up in neia. I'm willing to bet that they all have a sick feeling on the future of their hunting opportunities going forward after the threat of cwd and not knowing how that particular situation is going to be handled both short and long term.
    I'm sure you guys all know this already, but sit back and think for a minute just how quick things can change. Our deer herd is a very fragile resource.
    I'm going to choose to try and protect it each and every time I can. We do have plenty of time/options out there for taking deer already. Just look around and see what's going on in the world @ us. If you believe it will stop with straight wall rifle cartridges your doing nothing but kidding yourselves and not protecting hunting as we know it for our children. this is all JMO and what is important for me.
     
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  9. gunrunr

    gunrunr Life Member

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    That is how this all seems to work - first they allow straight wall cartridges,
    then when people are secure with that we add on 30-30 and calibers such as that
    and the next thing you know 300 UltraMag and 50BMG are legal for use in Iowa.
    After that people will say "HOW DID YOU LET THIS HAPPEN?"

    Would it be cool to shoot a deer with an antique 45-70 - YES
    But I am trying to think about the deer herd and all the hunters in Iowa as a whole and not just for myself
    I truly believe we need to stop adding seasons and extra weapons to the list considered LEGAL and think about the future
     
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  10. Sligh1

    Sligh1 Well-Known Member

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    These last 2 posts are right on the Money. Could not say if any better. BINGO!
     
  11. Fishbonker

    Fishbonker Well-Known Member

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    Passed out of committee today and will be eligible for floor debate soon
     
  12. Fishbonker

    Fishbonker Well-Known Member

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  13. Fishbonker

    Fishbonker Well-Known Member

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    Amendment offered today to add disabled to youth: Page 1, line 7, after < youth > by inserting < and 2 disabled >. Offered by Baxter of Hancock County the bill's manager and one of its many co sponsors.
     
  14. Hawk32

    Hawk32 Member

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    I sent a few emails again today. Keep them going out if you are opposed to this bill.
     
  15. mplane72

    mplane72 Member

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    Not to be Debbie Downer, I've sent my emails, but I'd be shocked if this doesn't pass. It's a gun bill in a Republican controlled congress. You can argue all you want about conservation ain't going to matter right now IMO.
     
  16. StickersNKickers

    StickersNKickers Camo Up!

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    One question I have is on the ammunition. This is limiting to the same ammunition as for pistols, correct? So nothing in the same caliber but amped up for a rifle that may be able to take a higher blast? I asked because I've seen some .357Mag ammunition that was labeled for rifle only, which I assume means it's been amped up but using the same cartridge.

    Please tell me your proposal also includes participation trophies for everyone!

    I might be ok with a one buck rule as I like shoulder mounts and can't really afford to mount more than one a year and usually don't even get the chance to shoot more than one a year, at least bucks that I would shoot.

    I agree with the possibility of more wounded deer. I think some people will take longer shots with a rifle using the same caliber/ammunition just because it is a rifle and "can shoot farther" or "more accurately" than its pistol counterpart. True, the rifle may be able to be held more securely and most likely has a longer barrel (unless using the Joker gun from the first Michael Keaton Batman movie) to help with accuracy, but is there that much difference (not a ballistics expert, so honestly asking this question for my own knowledge) between the same ammunition coming from a pistol vs a rifle?

    Regarding the muzzleloader, just wondering, what is the maximum effective range of this type of load, given the shooter has the ability to make the shot? I'm thinking some "recoil sensitive" people don't like the idea of using this as it is only one shot and want a quick follow up shot if necessary, and possibly don't think it will perform at longer ranges.

    I do know some people that will likely use a rifle vs a pistol or shotgun if given the chance.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2017
  17. Fishbonker

    Fishbonker Well-Known Member

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    This bill is on the debate calendar for Monday the 6th. This doesn't mean it will be debated/voted on just that it is now on the calendar. There are bills that have been on the calendar for several weeks. There are also bills that were proposed, debated, passed and signed by the Governor in less than 2 weeks. The collective bargaining bill for one.
     
  18. StickersNKickers

    StickersNKickers Camo Up!

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    BTW, I see it next to the time stamp at the bottom of my posts. Maybe you've already seen it.
     
  19. Fishbonker

    Fishbonker Well-Known Member

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    I thought maybe since there was a poll attached to the post it wasn't showing up so after you posted I looked an other posts I have made in other threads. No joy on the edit button. "Report" is the only button I have next to the time stamp just below my sig line. Maybe if I switched to Chrome of Firefox or something it would show up.
     
  20. Fishbonker

    Fishbonker Well-Known Member

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    This bill passed out of the House yesterday on a 96-0 vote with 4 Representatives absent. It is now in the Senate.
     
  21. Fishbonker

    Fishbonker Well-Known Member

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    Also, it will have the HF 475 number in the Senate.
     

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