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Muzzleloader Shooting Woes

J

JOHN DEERE

Member
This was my first season shooting a muzzleloader(Knight .50 calibar disc rifle). I have fired the gun around 80 times and have it well sighted in at 100 yards, 5 inch groups. I just can't connect without a rest. I have missed several nice bucks at around 100 yards. What can be done to correct my problem? Has anyone tried shooting sticks? I might as well be throwing rocks.
 
I learned the hard way. When on the ground I now sit with a small tree in front of me to use as a rest. Clear away the leaves when you sit so you can swivel around the tree with minimal noise

I learned to do this after missing a 147 class buck. How do I know? My buddy shot it the next day.

If in a stand, I freehand it. I would use a rest if my stand had one. But can honestly say the last three I shot were while walking back to truck and I shot freehand. Distances were 20 yards, 135 and 70. The one at 20 was my worst hit, couldn't find it. My nose found it two week later. With scoped (1.5 - 5X Simmons) Knight Wolverine.
 
5" groups with a Knight at 100 yards?....should be doing better than that, are you cleaning after a few shots?

There is no substitute for practice...try shooting offhand or small bore silhouette competitions with .22's in the off season. Quick response snap shooting will aid you when hunting season begins. This can be done with a .22 and tin cans or swinger targets.

I've seen too many hunters that only shot with a benchrest....only to find there were none when they got to the woods, they spent so much time looking for a gun rest that they missed some real nice critters. Don't know of very many trophy animals that are patient enough to wait for most shooters....

[This message has been edited by Rembrandt (edited 01-07-2002).]
 
Hey JD, I have the same exact gun and am getting 2 inch groups at 100 yards. 150 grains of powder and a 220 gr red hot. You should be shooting alot better then you are. Also, my gun shoots better with a dirty barrel then with a clean and polished barrel. I do swab with a spit patch after most shots. I say most because sometimes the circumstance doesn't allow time to swab. This is how I found out that my gun will shoot better with a dirty barrel. Try it and see how you do.
 
JD

You might try cutting a branch that you could use as a shooting stick from your stand. just set it between your legs and shoot off it. I had the same problem but when I could get a good brace that problem went away. I tend to avoid tree stands in the late season and sit on the ground, that way you can brace off both knees. Of course the wind can be a factor then. If you go to the ground you could sit closer to where the deer are moving and stay pretty well hidden. Good luck!

MW
 
How many different loads and bullet combinations have you tried? Every gun shoots different charges, and bullet weights. If you haven't already, read your owners manual that came with your gun. It spells out specifically how to arrive at your personal load. Make sure your gun is shooting to the best of it's ability before deciding to do anything. I currently shoot a Knight Disc that shoots 1" groups, and before that I had a Knight Wolverine that shot the same.
 
5 inch groups was a conservative estimate. At this time I am using 240 grain TC sabots and 150 grains of pyrodex pellets . I am worried about knock down power of a smaller bullet, though I have not seen the knock down power of what I shoot now. What have your experiences been with lighter bullets? Thanks for the input. You can bet I will be spending a lot of time practicing before next season rolls around.
 
JD

If you put any bullet in the rib cage you'll kill the deer no questions asked. Going through shoulder meat and bone may be a different story. I've never shot anything but 304 grain remington sabots and they make BIG holes no matter where they hit. Some people shoot bigger, some smaller, the main thing is finding a bullet that shoots for you and your 150 grains of powder! I would think that little 240 g bullet must be screaming!

MW

MW
 
Don't concern yourself with the weight of the bullet as much as bullet placement. I shoot 200 grain Knight Red Hot Bullets with 2 50 grain pellets. I shot a buck last year at around 100 yrds..heart shot..he fell over dead. Nice wound channel. Before next season I want to get mine shooting 3 pellets with whatever weight bullet that shoots well. I always look at it this way: I shoot 150 grain bullets through my .300 Win Mag, and that's plenty of bullet for deer. The lighter the bullet, the flatter the trajectory.
 
I shot a big doe (140 lbs. FD)at 100 yards tonight and it only went 50 yards. I shoot Hornady 240 gr. JHP with 100 gr. of pyrodex out of my BK92 Knight and always have. Most of the deer I shoot never go much farther and some drop on the spot. I shoot 1" groups and run 1 patch through between shots. One deer down and one to go. :)
G6
 
John, I have a couple questions for you.

1) Are you using a scope or open sights? If they are open are they a tru-glow type. A 5 inch group at 100 yards with open sights isn't too bad. (especially if your gettig old like me)

2) How sure are you of that distance you missed at wasn't closer to 150 or 200 yards? (I'm always skeptical when someone says about 100)



[This message has been edited by IaCraig (edited 01-08-2002).]
 
I have a Knight Wolverine shoot 100 grns Ffg black powder w/ 240 grn nosler hc bullet have a 1 " group at 100 yrds off the bench can keep them in a 3" bull offhanded but the first shot out of a "clean" barrel will go anywhere, always has out of this gun. Am going to try this new none corrosive blk powder called "clean bore" this summer
 
I think your problem is the TC sabots. I tried those in my knight and couldnt get a good group at all. I could tell by the tear in the paper they were tumbling. Try 250 or 300 grain Barnes Bullets.
 
i have shoot this gun for 4 years and have come up with a cleaning and load formula that will shoot less than 2 " at 150 yards without cleaning between shots.
#1- BRUSH the bore with solvent- 4 complete passes
#2- use 4 wet patches- use both sides[8 total passes
#3- use 2 dry patches-both sides
#4- dry fire it TWICE using only 209 primers. this "fouls out" the bore and will make shot number 1,2,3 and 4 hit the same.
#5-clean it after 4 shots.
the best load i have found is this:
3-50 grain pyrodex pellets
250 grain thompson center TPX bullet
t/c magnum sabot[red] they perform beeter than any other i have found.
cleaning and fouling are the trick to be able to shoot 3,4 and even 5 shot groups with this gun. it is good out to 200 plus yards ! i've done it!last night i shot a nice 8 pointer at 155 yards with a "texas heart shot" that dropped him in his tracks and went end to end inside.
 
i have shoot this gun for 4 years and have come up with a cleaning and load formula that will shoot less than 2 " at 150 yards without cleaning between shots.
#1- BRUSH the bore with solvent- 4 complete passes
#2- use 4 wet patches- use both sides[8 total passes
#3- use 2 dry patches-both sides
#4- dry fire it TWICE using only 209 primers. this "fouls out" the bore and will make shot number 1,2,3 and 4 hit the same.
#5-clean it after 4 shots.
the best load i have found is this:
3-50 grain pyrodex pellets
250 grain thompson center TPX bullet
t/c magnum sabot[red] they perform beeter than any other i have found.
cleaning and fouling are the trick to be able to shoot 3,4 and even 5 shot groups with this gun. it is good out to 200 plus yards ! i've done it!last night i shot a nice 8 pointer at 155 yards with a "texas heart shot" that dropped him in his tracks and went end to end inside.
 
JD, I agree with Greendeen , I also have 50cal Knight disc and I tryed TCbullets and red sabots an had very poor groups. The Barnes bullets and high pressure sabots perform the best I found .. 1" to 2" groups at 100yds with 250grain bullets an 100grainsor 2pellets. Excellent for Quick kill for deer..
 
Rudy, Good informative post on your "Recipe" for good groups. But in my opinion a "TEXAS HEART SHOT" shows Poor Form. I can't imagine shooting a deer in the butt on purpose, unless your finishing off a cripple.

Your entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine, on this one we'll have to disagree.
 
craig- i wouldn't think of taking that shot with anything less than perfect aim and angle. i know that the load i shoot,250 grain bullet going 2,040 feet per second produces 2310.77 foot pounds of kenetic energy. thats enough power to ensure a humane kill on large african game at 200 yards. don't get me wrong, it might sound unethical but i am confident that it was going to result in major trama to the target. i wouldn't think of taking a shot with any type of weapon that would result in anything less than a sure kill and do not want to, or mean to, encourage anybody else to do so either.good huntin'-rudy
 
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