New approach to QDM??

[glasgowm]

Ok, I've been trying to think outside the box.

Here's the issue. I grew up in IA and have hunted deer in IA, IL, KY, WI, MN and KS. Up until coming here I was used to bucks cruising for does but once a day they would tend to make it back to their core area. (not always but typically) Here in KS the bucks cruise much bigger loops. I have mature bucks here that will travel as far as 4 miles from their core area on a loop that I'm guessing takes them more that 12 miles total and they will be away for 3 days cruising for a hot doe.

I've been working on my buck to doe ratio for 2 years and am below 1 to 2 but the mature bucks seem to be gone from my area for even longer now than before, when the rut's hot.

My thinking is this, I know a 1 to 1 ratio has been a goal of QDM, to intensify the rut, but if the bucks just range further to find a hot doe, how about trying to hold more doe to keep him home.

This summer I had 3 B&C deer on the 1600 acres I spend most of my time on. I had 12 buck total on the land and 21 doe and yearlings. The 3 big ones kicked the crap out of eachother and ended up ranging far and wide looking for a little more tail. I have plenty of cover, food and water to support many more deer than I have.

Does it make sense to try to hold more doe, and therefore shrink the range the mature bucks will travel for a hot doe? I know that according to traditional QDM theory, the rut won't be as intense but if the mature bucks aren't even staying on the property, does it matter how intense it is?

2 years ago I lost a 187 inch 10 point that I hunted hard with bow. He got taken 3.5 miles away on the opening day of rifle by a guy who had never seen him before, while he was on a hot doe. This year I lost a 170 10 point that got taken by rifle 2 miles away in one direction and another a little bigger than that 3 miles in the other direction. The big typical I was after got all busted up fighting with a big NT on the property (I watched it at 600 yards).

There is no other reason for these deer to move off of the property. They are not pressured and they have anything they could need, except for plenty of does to chase.

Like I said, I know this is unconventional thinking but what do some of you think? Thanks in advance.

Matthew

 

[Shredder]

It sounds like a good concept. My only deal with it is if a mature buck is going to roam, he is going to roam. Not sure if that sounds right but some of the ground I have hunted is loaded with does as well as the surrounding areas and the bucks still feel the need to cruise in search of a hot one. If they scent check the does in the immediate area and none are in heat, they keep looking and walk til they find one.

 

[glasgowm]

Thank you for your response. Not to be argumentative, but the more does you have on the property, the more likely they will find a hot one to keep them home right? I'm not saying it will solve the issue of the mature bucks roaming, but doesn't it make sense that it would improve the odds of keeping the big boys home?

I am interested in people's responses whether you think I'm on to something or full of it. I know I've never read this concept on a QDM thread before, but I'm currious.

Matthew

 

[Central Iowa]

[ QUOTE ]
This summer I had 3 B&C deer on the 1600 acres I spend most of my time on. I had 12 buck total on the land and 21 doe and yearlings.

[/ QUOTE ] With only 33 deer on 1600 acres I would want to let my herd grow if it was me. According to your post 1:1 would mean you would only have 24 deer on that 1600 acres(yearling bucks counted as does). I think it would be important to have a larger, healthy herd with a varied age structure before worrying about the ratio. I have hunted areas with very good ratios but have had that many deer in 20 acres so it's a diffrent game. In these areas these bucks still follow their nose during the rut. They could be hiding on the other side of the property with a hot doe and you would never know. I guess in short I would want a much larger herd on 1600 acres. Then work the ratio as you see fit.

 

[Old Buck]

I think what you are considering makes sense. I'm not sure there is anything in qdm that says sex ratio takes priority over having the population you want as long as the population is well within the carrying capacity of the land. I'd be tempted to let the population grow to the density (deer/square mile) I wanted then as your does produce more and more bucks reduce the does thereby adjusting the sex ratio and buck age structure.

 

[Ghost]

I would have to agree with some of the others, you could stand to increase the deer population on your 1600 acres.

Just a question..... How were you able to get such a precise assessment of your deer herd?

 

[glasgowm]

Thank you all for your responses. I'm glad to hear that I'm not out in left field somewhere.

Ghost, I have trail cams set up on the property. There are 5 main pieces of timber on the property and because of the steep banks and topography the deer enter and leave the timber in the same spot almost always. I have a cam on each of these spots. I've been able to see the deer enough on film to find identifying characteristics, so I can usually recognize them. There may be another buck or 2 that I've never gotten on film and I may be missing a few doe, but it's a pretty accurate count.

Matthew

 

[Bowhunt]

I would not find it hard for deer to roam a long ways during the rut. I have seen two deer this fall around the area I hunt roam over 3 miles. Both of these deer were 3 1/2 or 4 1/2. I missed one with my bow and it was then killed on our farm over 3 miles away this season.

 

[Liv4Rut]

I agree with all the others as well. I would think if you had that few of deer on that ground, plus 3 bucks of that caliber, that one will become the top dog, and could push a few of the others out. As far as bucks traveling, once they start walking they just don't stop. They will chase that doe until she is bred, and when he is done, he finds another and wherever she takes him, he will go. I had a super wide 9 pointer that i glassed over the summer about 3 miles away from where I passed him up. He lived close to a state park where the buck to do ratio is probably around 10 does to 1 buck, and even that number couldn't keep him there