Acorns to Oaks!

[OHIOshedder]

Looking for some help identifying scarlet-vs-schumard-vs-black oak. I have a tree that I think is a scarlet oak, the acorns have overlapping scales on the cap and leaves are pointed and deeply lobed almost like a pin oak. I'm seeing a lot of conflicting pictures in random internet searches and hoping maybe you guys have some tips that I could use to identify one or the other. Thanks in advance...

 

[dbltree]

Looking for some help identifying scarlet-vs-schumard-vs-black oak. I have a tree that I think is a scarlet oak, the acorns have overlapping scales on the cap and leaves are pointed and deeply lobed almost like a pin oak. I'm seeing a lot of conflicting pictures in random internet searches and hoping maybe you guys have some tips that I could use to identify one or the other. Thanks in advance...

I have tons of black oak not neither of the other two so far as i know but perhaps someone else can help?

 

[DWilk]

Looking for some help identifying scarlet-vs-schumard-vs-black oak. I have a tree that I think is a scarlet oak, the acorns have overlapping scales on the cap and leaves are pointed and deeply lobed almost like a pin oak. I'm seeing a lot of conflicting pictures in random internet searches and hoping maybe you guys have some tips that I could use to identify one or the other. Thanks in advance...

Do you have any pictures? Specifically, pictures of a few acorns, some buds, and a few different leaves (all three with a ruler or something for size reference). A photo of the tree as a whole and of the bark would be helpful as well.

 

[letemgrow]

Do you have any pictures? Specifically, pictures of a few acorns, some buds, and a few different leaves (all three with a ruler or something for size reference). A photo of the tree as a whole and of the bark would be helpful as well.

Yep, pics would really help out.

 

[bowman]

I have had the best luck storing the acorns in a ziploc bag in some damp peat moss (Miracle Gro potting soil) but some prefer a lunch sack or some such but all stored in the fridge for the winter...pick up a dozen or hundreds and get some seedlings started next spring... :way:

Another dumb question. I just picked up a bunch of swamp white acorns, float tested them, and they are currently in a zip lock with a damp paper towel in the refrigerator. I need to buy some peat moss. Is Miracle Grow Potting soil peat moss or does Miracle Grow sell peat moss? I'm easily confused.

 

[letemgrow]

Another dumb question. I just picked up a bunch of swamp white acorns, float tested them, and they are currently in a zip lock with a damp paper towel in the refrigerator. I need to buy some peat moss. Is Miracle Grow Potting soil peat moss or does Miracle Grow sell peat moss? I'm easily confused.

That potting soil is peat moss based so yes to both.

You can buy straight peat from wal-mart, Ace etc. It is usually in a white/green colored bag.

 

[DH1]

Is Miracle Grow Potting soil peat moss or does Miracle Grow sell peat moss?

Peat Moss - plain: lower PH, no nutrients, cheaper than potting soil, useful for sandy soil to help with water retention

Miracle grow/Schultz potting mix: peat moss, PH nutruel (lime added), NPK added, most of it slow release, cost more but you'll want to use this anyway for starting your acorns in when they are being potted.

I would think the plain peat without nutrients would work better for storage when you are hoping that that they don't sprout anytime soon but I don't know if it matters for storage.

 

[dbltree]

October 27th, 2011

I started oak, chestnut and eastern gamagrass seed in Rootmaker cells in early April this year and kept them growing all summer....

White, red and dwarf chinkapin oaks along with Timburr chestnuts from Okios Tree Crops

Last year summer rains were plentiful so I transplanted part of them mid summer but this year was a far different story so I kept them well watered in the RM cells

The chestnuts and red oaks put on the most growth while the white oaks were much slower growing

I moved some trees like these Timburr chestnuts into Roottrapper bags and with "room to roam" they grew twice as large as those left in the RM cells.

Concordia oak

These are pics of the eastern gamagrass root systems when pulled out of the cells...

Dwarf Chinkapin oak seedling...the chestnuts came out easily but the oak roots attach to the bag fabric, not a big deal but takes a bit more to get the roots loose so don't expect it to come out in a neat package like the Rootmaker cells.

The Rootmaker cells have proven to be the most economical yet most effective way to start almost any seedling and the root growth is phenomenal. The cells will last for years if treated properly and Big Rock Trees is a great source for Rootmaker cells and bags.

I tubed everything with the last of the Protex tubes...and hauled water to the transplants since the ground is powder dry

The Protex tubes are very functional but a bit of a pain to assemble so a friend sent me a link to a source for Tree Pro tubes where I found very reasonable prices for tubes and bamboo stakes.

Timber Management

5' ventilated tubes are $2.50 each for 100+ and 1" x 5' bamboo stakes are $1.13 and the owner Mike Hamilton said shipping would be $20 per bundle of 50 tubes and 50 stakes so my next tube purchase will be from Mike!

I looked at 250 of these tubes that had been up since spring and not one was down or out of place, something that I cannot say for many other types of tree tubes. Timber Management and Seed is also a source for acorns and other seeds as well... :way:

 

[SDHunt24/7]

Dbltree: What website did you buy from Mike at. When I googled treepro I got treepro.com with someone named Tom Mills as the president. The tubes on this site are much more expensive for 60" tubes than you paid. I would love to order some of these tubes that you ordered. My protex tubes have been ok, but I have had several of them come open in the wind and also from cattle and deer rubbing on them. The bucks this fall have been knocking them around. Thanks.

 

[SDHunt24/7]

I am a little slow tonight!! I just clicked on the Timber Management link and now I see the tubes, but the 5' tubes are $3 and the 4' tubes are $2.50. Did you get a mass quantity deal or something? The 5 footers say 1-99 $3. Sure would like to find something that doesn't come open. Thanks.

 

[SDHunt24/7]

Wow!! As I said I am slow tonight Plus the kids are distracting me. I see the larger quantity 100+ discount. Let me know how these tubes hold up.

 

[dbltree]

Wow!! As I said I am slow tonight Plus the kids are distracting me. I see the larger quantity 100+ discount. Let me know how these tubes hold up.

Glad it makes sense now...what doesn't make sense is buying anywhere else...:way:

 

[dbltree]

I checked on some of the Protex tubes at a friends farm while checking his cams and as always...most of them are fine...

Others...not so much...in this case I think a buck ripped into it, opened it and broke off a young hybrid oak that had several years growth...kinda disheartening. While any tube can suffered an attack by hormone charged bucks these style of tubes are very vulnerable to opening up and exposing the young tree to damage.

Solid tubes may get tipped over such as this

or this

but will not do this

In this case from animals chewing on them...the tabs and edges make them vulnerable to "chewing" that doesn't occur with solid tubes.

The tabs are a challenge from the get go because they are "stamped" out with perforations that must then be opened up one by one and the female side also opened and since they are often not cut entirely through one has to cut them with a knife. Not a problem for 20 tubes but to do 500 or more it is a real time consuming task.

The perforations on many of them are shifted and so bottom and top my not line up and fit right and that allows high winds to buffet them until they come loose.

On the plus side the material is pretty much indestructible and will last years longer then most other tubes, most of which are designed to "self destruct" or biodegrade over time so that they will slough away from the young tree without eventually girdling it. Young trees do grow well in them and they are probably one of the least expensive options.

If spending countless hours assembling tubes is of no consequence and preferable to spending a few cents more per tube and maintaining the tubes that come apart then these tubes might be right for you. A couple of options to help hold them together might be duct tape around the tube and post and/or a minimum of 14" zip tie to go around the entire tube and post. (16" is better but harder to find)

My thoughts are that duct tape would also prevent the tube from sliding down the post and like the tube material would last for years, the downside again is that this would be also very laborious. If you live at your property and can maintain them it's probably not a huge deal but even then...I have better things to do with my time then put these things back together every couple months...

 

[letemgrow]

Something else to consider about solid tubes...make sure and take them off the seedling before they get too big out of the top of the tube and send out lateral branches....they can be a burger to get off if they get too big before they are pulled off and the lateral branches cannot be moved.

Those that open up are much easier to take off the if they are left on the tree longer...but more time consuming than solid tubes to assemble. I am interested to see how long those miracle tubes last by tree pro. They sure will save a lot of time over assembling protex tubes that is for certain.

 

[letemgrow]

If anyone gets tired of their protex tubes and switches....I will gladly pay ya to take them off your hands

Once they are assembled, I can use them on 3-4 different tree plantings without having to assemble them again.

 

[SDHunt24/7]

Thanks again for the updates and info on the tubes fellas. I was home for 8 days deer hunting on our land in north central NE south central SD and out of 200 ported blue tubes the deer had demolished around 20 of them. After some effort I was able to put them back around the trees. I have also had either coons or coyotes chewing on a few of the tubes. I think I may try some of the tubes Dbltree was talking about a couple weeks ago. I have some dwarf chinkapin acorns from bob in NE that I need to plant after growing them in root makers next spring. Am I ok to keep them in the fridge and pot them in the spring? I have had them in the fridge for a month now at around 40 degrees and a couple of them have started to sprout in the ziplock bag. The fridge is in the garage.

 

[dbltree]

Am I ok to keep them in the fridge and pot them in the spring? I have had them in the fridge for a month now at around 40 degrees and a couple of them have started to sprout in the ziplock bag. The fridge is in the garage.

You bet...almost all of mine sprout over winter so that is pretty normal, just keep them refrigerated until planting into rootmakers in late winter/early spring.:way:

 

[SDHunt24/7]

You bet...almost all of mine sprout over winter so that is pretty normal, just keep them refrigerated until planting into rootmakers in late winter/early spring.:way:

Good. Thanks for the reassurance.

 

[letemgrow]

The colder you keep them the better IMO, this will delay them from putting on much of a tap root till you take them out come spring. Mine are just above freezing in the bottom of the fridge and they have just cracked open to show they are viable seeds. Very few have a 1/4" or less tap root coming out.

If you store them too warm in the fridge, you will have a mass or roots to untangle come spring.

 

[Bryan95]

Hey guys thought I would share some of my oaks with all of you guys. Im not all sure on if I know 100% on what they are but I think I do but tell me if Im wrong. This thread has helped me alot thanks dbltree!
These are just some of my oaks. The pins are going crazy! Just a few sprouted white oaks so far and no reds or burs yet.

Pin oak? correct?

White oak?

Sorry not all the greatest pics but thank you!