Giant Deer of Iowa are rapidly becoming a past memory

[Iowa]

I

I agree, nobody needs more than 2 bucks. If we were to lobby for a 2 buck limit, what tag would you like to see or suggest be eliminated? There were only 215 +/- hunters that used 3 tags on bucks last year. That is less than 1/2% of the total bucks harvested. Is eliminating a tag really going to affect much? Maybe make it a 2 deer limit and address two fronts, bucks & population at the same time.

Going after the LO tag isn’t going to go over well. You saw that when the ISC tried to get the acreage limit through earlier this year. A 2 buck limit across the board with LO’s still getting their discounted tag would probably get little resistance. I honestly don’t know a good solution when going after tags.

Population is the first thing that needs addressed and while the DNR is trying, they need to cut back on doe tags in more areas. Even then, with the way they are in “pockets” due to lack of habitat, locked up ground, etc…, it’s going to take more. Updating their survey procedures would help with identifying those areas I’d think. You can’t just drive down the same roads every year and expect it to be accurate. Too much change in environment isn’t taken into account.

As for how many deer a family needs, who are we to judge. With the economy and beef prices, I’m sure an extra 100lbs of burger in the freezer could help quite a few. For the ones that can’t hunt their own, the Hush program also helps a lot of people.

I think we need to decide whether the bigger issue is a lack of deer or a lack of wall hangars. It seems like a lot of the frustration is fewer “wall hangars”. Addressing the lack of deer itself will solve that. My first tags were “buck” only, maybe more areas need to go back to that. It obviously got us to a great point at one time.

I think the landowner tag should count against one of the statewide tags. That way the landowners can’t say they don’t get their cheaper tag.

 

[Wi transplant]

Two words: High Grading. There's is one thing about deer that I wished I never learned and that is the fact that only 3 out of 10 bucks are above average from an antler standpoint. The book, Strategic Harvest System: How to Break Through the Buck Management Glass Ceiling, outlines this fact and how a herd should be managed if you want next level bucks. Concept is easy, but not realistic in all but the largest management blocks IMO.

Bucks are definitely getting to 5 years old, even in MO, which has far more pressure than Iowa. I’ve been hunting in extreme Northern Missouri since 2005, and we still have plenty of bucks reaching 5 years old. The problem now, is it’s far more of the “wrong” ones getting to 5. I haven’t had a next level buck to hunt in MO since 2018. High grading!
Everyone is selective now, BUT not selective enough. They select the 140’s plus 3 and 4 year olds when they used to shoot the first decent buck and be done. Hunters are too good at killing them now: cell cams, everyone now has standing grain for late season, improved weapons, EHD, youth seasons, and in MO you can add crossbows, longer gun seasons, multiple youth seasons, over the counter tags, DNR sharp shooting, etc.

Twice in the last 2 days I’ve had Youtube videos on my feed where guys got cell pics of their target one night, packed up and drove hours from another state, then killed them the next day. I’d support banning cell cams.

I believe MO is a lost cause, but IMO, if the population in Iowa was allowed increase significantly, the numbers game becomes a win for the bucks. Iowa is killing ½ as many deer now days as they killed back around 2008 which translates into about ½ as many deer on the landscape today. With all else equal, more bucks = more of the right bucks getting to 5 and 6.

I 100pct agree I truly believe ehd has nocked numbers back in alot of areas not just mature bucks and when numbers in general are down simple math less mature bucks also ! Lots of doe tags and late doe seasons all take a toll on the numbers

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[booneriverbucks]

I

I think the landowner tag should count against one of the statewide tags. That way the landowners can’t say they don’t get their cheaper tag.

I agree, but if their first tag is a bow tag their second tag should still be able to be used statewide for one of the gun seasons.. that way they are not “getting less” than a non landowner or limited to only hunting their land.

Landowner spring turkey tag is kind of odd. It is at a reduced price but is valid on your land only and still counts as your 2nd and final tag.. I suppose plenty are happy just to have it cheap

 

[Sligh1]

That was actually meant to be a joke ! Glad you mighta noticed that!

Totally agree with most of the above.. only arguement is there are many “managing for age” that hardly ever actually kill anything and just like to blame everyone else for their lack of success. We all know them!! Many fail to realize how hard it is to do consistently! Most of us see or get pictures of ones we’d love to get but few actually pull it off consistently.
My issue with many of the “trophy hunters”.. hate saying that cuz I am one (we’ll ignore whether I’m successful or not) is that MANY totally fail to realize how extremely GOOD they had it in the past. Many were the only guys that had a clue about deer in their area 20+ years ago. Very few areas were seriously bow hunted by guys that had any idea what they were actually doing. Look at all the BS products people fell for back then! All the “dumb” neighbors finally moved away from whacking the first year and half year old that walked by and now hold out for “older bucks”.. yes they might only be 2-3 but they are “bigger than the old days”. Lots of guys were without a doubt ahead of the game back then and I have no doubt that they’ve seen a decrease in top end quality due to their neighbors new success. There was a time when they were probably the only ones that had a chance in the whole neighborhood other than someone getting lucky. The game has changed. It is without a doubt harder. When we were given our extremely long bow season we had little of the tech and very few had the knowledge we have today.. We need to be honest with ourselves tho and admit it’s still pretty good. Very few would trade for November gun seasons, crossbows and many other regs other states have for what we have now. Those regs did not come out of a vacuum. All were created as a compromise from all hunters in their respective states. We could have it worse!!
On another note.. The great news for lots of bowhunters in the state is the giant amount of snow many of us just got will no doubt slow down many during the gun seasons. Should be a good year next year!

Oh- I know it was a joke, good stuff. I’m way too much into politics, economics, history, following what’s going on in the world, etc. Very familiar with Davos…. I think our old buddy Klaus is out if I recall.
One complete ADHD side tangent…. It’s interesting to me how many parallels hunting has with life…. Ups & downs, difficulties, what you reap vs sow. places in world or country regulated well or poorly. The issues man creates in many cases being his own worst enemy at times but also so many cases for doing good as well.
Hunting has God’s life lessons built right into this sport. In His outdoors everyday & can’t be thankful enough for that. We are blessed (& spoiled too ) & overall this is a fantastic thing we all can experience. Why I feel it’s our duty to leave it as good or better for the next generation or others to experience as well.

Agree on rest. I’m a “trophy” guy too - in that I want a balanced age class. Quality managed herd. I’ll admit- hunting states with few to no older deer- it’s ruined and personally, I have no interest doing it. Ruined states- I’d still probably go sit. Shoot a doe. Or take up bird hunting…. But ruined places absolutely make dudes quit or leave or do something else. Why there really is no downside in a system that has a balanced age class across the landscape on average. Which is what iowa really has always had. Still has- just dwindled. It’ll come back.
Agree & there’s zero doubt that folks of iowa better be super thankful for what we have. We might have it “tough” but: 1) it’ll come back & 2) good gosh are other states just destroyed in so many examples. We are lucky, blessed and I’m thankful for what we have 100%!!!!!

 

[MN Slick]

That was actually meant to be a joke ! Glad you mighta noticed that!

Totally agree with most of the above.. only arguement is there are many “managing for age” that hardly ever actually kill anything and just like to blame everyone else for their lack of success. We all know them!! Many fail to realize how hard it is to do consistently! Most of us see or get pictures of ones we’d love to get but few actually pull it off consistently.
My issue with many of the “trophy hunters”.. hate saying that cuz I am one (we’ll ignore whether I’m successful or not) is that MANY totally fail to realize how extremely GOOD they had it in the past. Many were the only guys that had a clue about deer in their area 20+ years ago. Very few areas were seriously bow hunted by guys that had any idea what they were actually doing. Look at all the BS products people fell for back then! All the “dumb” neighbors finally moved away from whacking the first year and half year old that walked by and now hold out for “older bucks”.. yes they might only be 2-3 but they are “bigger than the old days”. Lots of guys were without a doubt ahead of the game back then and I have no doubt that they’ve seen a decrease in top end quality due to their neighbors new success. There was a time when they were probably the only ones that had a chance in the whole neighborhood other than someone getting lucky. The game has changed. It is without a doubt harder. When we were given our extremely long bow season we had little of the tech and very few had the knowledge we have today.. We need to be honest with ourselves tho and admit it’s still pretty good. Very few would trade for November gun seasons, crossbows and many other regs other states have for what we have now. Those regs did not come out of a vacuum. All were created as a compromise from all hunters in their respective states. We could have it worse!!
On another note.. The great news for lots of bowhunters in the state is the giant amount of snow many of us just got will no doubt slow down many during the gun seasons. Should be a good year next year!

You NAILED IT!! I'm even a trophy hunter that hardly ever kills anything anymore, LOL!!! I don't blame others though, I expect them to shoot 3 and 4 year old studs. Why wouldn't they? I'm the idiot!

They other day a buddy told me it was odd why my North MO farm has gone downhill the last 7 years. You listed every reason why it's gone down hill.

 

[Hardwood11]

What can archers give up?

Just an idea- Not advocating either way

You could make the 3 tags some qualify for and make it two max. Then stipulate only one can be during the first archery split. (If you want to shoot one with a bow during late season instead of a gun doesn't make a lot of seance to limit that). So you could shoot one deer with a bow, 1 deer with a gun, OR 2 with a bow, but only one can be before gun seasons.

Then very minor stuff like the auto ranging electronic sights. That shit should go away.

The archery season ends Dec 31 !! … & one archery buck tag ! This would be a huge upgrade !

 

[booneriverbucks]

Oh- I know it was a joke, good stuff. I’m way too much into politics, economics, history, following what’s going on in the world, etc. Very familiar with Davos…. I think our old buddy Klaus is out if I recall.

Haha. Yep! No more Klaus! I think its Larry Fink and a few others that will be telling us to eat more bugs and consume less resources from now on. Just thankful they haven’t decided that deer contribute to global warming or climate change or whatever they are calling it now.

 

[Slick]

Big Buck killed in Indiana with use of Drone.

 

[DMarley83]

Here ia another reason for Iowa decline.

This segmenting is hard to believe any county would go for this.

This is ridiculous. Im sure it is the realtors suggestion.

Update on the odd shaped farm auction. Hopefully same buyer bought most or all of it.

 

[Daver]

Welp...short, short version...due, IMO, to a combination of factors...we have received info from the neighbors that ALL of the known "up and coming" 3 and 4 year olds have been taken down this hunting season. Factors = harsh weather in the firearms season combined with awesome food sources, cell cams, rifles, land segmentation, etc, are all at the top of the list. It is also true that we are still in a rebuilding mode following heavy EHD loss in 2023, that is playing a part too,

At any rate...hard to be optimistic about the future at the rate things are going. Have heard multiple variations of, "I know he was only 4, but he was the biggest one on cam...". AND...I would consider ours to be a "good" neighborhood. At least SOME of us are choosing to let bucks get to 5+...but, alas, not all are. Anymore, it is just too east to take out a given deer, if one so desires, when you can watch them on camera and/or be alerted to them "daylighting" in a given field, etc, etc. Load your gun, go in for one sit on a prime, remote food source in frigid conditions and blammo. Time for a "grip and grin" photo. Oh, and often accompanied by a, "I can't believe that just happened..." expression. SMH.

We have medium racked 5 year old still unaccounted for, but not seen in 5 weeks, so kinda skeptical that he is still breathing. Otherwise...wipeout on anything older than 2. We need to dial it back IMO.

 

[tall@wide]

Welp...short, short version...due, IMO, to a combination of factors...we have received info from the neighbors that ALL of the known "up and coming" 3 and 4 year olds have been taken down this hunting season. Factors = harsh weather in the firearms season combined with awesome food sources, cell cams, rifles, land segmentation, etc, are all at the top of the list. It is also true that we are still in a rebuilding mode following heavy EHD loss in 2023, that is playing a part too,

At any rate...hard to be optimistic about the future at the rate things are going. Have heard multiple variations of, "I know he was only 4, but he was the biggest one on cam...". AND...I would consider ours to be a "good" neighborhood. At least SOME of us are choosing to let bucks get to 5+...but, alas, not all are. Anymore, it is just too east to take out a given deer, if one so desires, when you can watch them on camera and/or be alerted to them "daylighting" in a given field, etc, etc. Load your gun, go in for one sit on a prime, remote food source in frigid conditions and blammo. Time for a "grip and grin" photo. Oh, and often accompanied by a, "I can't believe that just happened..." expression. SMH.

We have medium racked 5 year old still unaccounted for, but not seen in 5 weeks, so kinda skeptical that he is still breathing. Otherwise...wipeout on anything older than 2. We need to dial it back IMO.

I’ve been dealing with the same thing for years now, and I don’t see anything changing in the future. Now you have to get into the counties with less hunting pressure and find a large farm to lease or buy. That’s the only real solution.. Killing the bucks is easy today with the technology but finding one to kill is almost impossible.

 

[Wi transplant]

I brought my first farm in iowa in 2018 and moved here full time in early 2020. I have never shot a buck on a different farm or public land since moving here ! I don't have big properties the first 80 acres then had to down size to a 40 (divorce) but still just made my piece as good as possible! Have I killed a 200 nope ! Got some nice bucks but the satisfaction i get from improving and hunting "my farm" far out weighs the size of the antlers!! To me that's where true trophy satisfaction comes from !!!

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[CottonwoodCanyon]

Just some anecdotal notes from my season because I think this year really applies to this thread. My wife and I hunt both Iowa and Nebraska every year, either farms we are part owners on or family farms and permission spots. Very similar farms in terms of size, habitat:agriculture, etc. but vastly different herd dynamics and neighbors. This is the first year ever that we have had bigger deer on the NE farms than the main IA farm. Here's some interesting things I noticed this year:

Deer numbers overall were pretty similar (high/improving) but the herds themselves very different.
IA had better sex ratio overall, NE was skewed towards does heavily
IA had more bucks (not surprising with a better sex ratio), but age class was skewed. Lots of promising 2-3 year olds.
IA had the oldest buck (est. 9 1/2+ and I still wasn't able to kill him..."junker" buck that would maybe score 100")
NE had bigger bucks but a big gap in the age structure. Lots of 1-2 year olds, then 2-3 mature bucks. Two mature bucks in mid 160s. My wife got one, would've been 164 if he hadn't broken a brow off and her biggest ever.

I do think the IA farm neighborhood is being seriously high graded. It's in a "notable" county but not a "notable" neighborhood. The NE farm, neighbors only shoot bucks but they aren't picky which used to bother me but now I think they shoot the first decent buck they see and every year a couple big/old/smart ones slip through. Different neighborhood dynamics, different herd dynamics. I think those are directly related.

 

[Hill_billydeluxe]

Pretty slow shotgun season for us here in SW Iowa. Everyone I’ve talked to is still reporting low deer numbers in our area. A lot of big groups don’t go out anymore. Here’s a couple things I’ve noticed though:

1. Deer numbers seem to be up in comparison to the 2023 and 2024 seasons. Lots more sightings and plenty of opportunities to shoot deer that we decided to pass as a group.
2. Because of the antlered only 1st shotgun season, it seems like most people in the area are choosing to go 2nd season.
3. We seem to have very few mature bucks around. Mostly saw does with a few 1-2 year old bucks mixed in. From what I’ve seen, it seems like EHD has had the biggest impact on mature bucks.
4. A lot of the orange army doesn’t seem to be aware of just how low the numbers are in our area. Can’t really blame them, I’d like to see some more education from the dnr on what our numbers look like and what we can all do to help things improve.
5. Our groups buck only strategy since 2023 has seemed to help. We went from seeing nearly nothing to at least seeing a handful of deer each day.
6. Coyote numbers are unreal. We saw the most coyotes we’ve ever seen by a long shot, partly due to the extreme cold but mostly because we have too many. We’re putting plans in place to do some coyote management this winter.

I’m overall pretty optimistic about the future. I think the dnr has been doing what they can as far as 0 doe tags and antlered only 1st shotgun. I believe if we keep doing the right things, in 5 years we might see one of the best deer herds we’ve had in a long time. We have limited cover in our area of SW Iowa which makes for a harder time building a deer herd but things do seem to be improving.


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[Windlooker]

On Saturday I visited a locker to drop off a deer. I pulled around back to drag the deer into the cooler. Next to the cooler door were at least 20 sawed off buck heads. Everyone was 1 or 2 years old, not one older. This was the last weekend of gun 2, can’t imagine how many little bucks were taken overall. I wish I would have snapped a pic. IMO that’s a result of driving, sharing tags, shooting running deer and looking after. I’m not against driving, but this is the result. We wonder why big deer are fading away.

 

[CottonwoodCanyon]

Glad to hear a decent report and optimism from @Hill_billydeluxe . I didn't hunt SW IA near home this year but I did talk to many of my contacts about deer. Mainly farmers, pheasant hunters and longtime gun groups in Harrison, Pott,, Mills, Fremont and some in the next counties east. Still hearing pretty bad reports, especially in sparce habitat areas. Some drives with zero deer seen. One of the largest farmers in the area told me he didn't even buy a gun tag this year after seeing little to nothing during harvest. Hoping for a rebound but I don't know if it'll be next year...

 

[Matthewfox_45]

On Saturday I visited a locker to drop off a deer. I pulled around back to drag the deer into the cooler. Next to the cooler door were at least 20 sawed off buck heads. Everyone was 1 or 2 years old, not one older. This was the last weekend of gun 2, can’t imagine how many little bucks were taken overall. I wish I would have snapped a pic. IMO that’s a result of driving, sharing tags, shooting running deer and looking after. I’m not against driving, but this is the result. We wonder why big deer are fading away.

Or people are just filling their freezers and shooting what makes them happy.

 

[Hill_billydeluxe]

Glad to hear a decent report and optimism from @Hill_billydeluxe . I didn't hunt SW IA near home this year but I did talk to many of my contacts about deer. Mainly farmers, pheasant hunters and longtime gun groups in Harrison, Pott,, Mills, Fremont and some in the next counties east. Still hearing pretty bad reports, especially in sparce habitat areas. Some drives with zero deer seen. One of the largest farmers in the area told me he didn't even buy a gun tag this year after seeing little to nothing during harvest. Hoping for a rebound but I don't know if it'll be next year...

We’re western Pott county. We had plenty of drives turn out with no deer seen. I think that’s partly due to the extreme cold we had, my assumption is deer moved into river bottoms searching for thicker cover and unpressured areas. When we did find the deer we almost always found several which was a nice change.

I’ve noticed a a shift in mindset in a lot of people I’ve talked to. There’s still some folk that shoot the first one they see. However, it seems like each year more people are holding out for decent bucks. We’ll never get everyone on the same page of managing for mature bucks but it’s been nice to see more people aim for that.


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[Buckscrape]

Or people are just filling their freezers and shooting what makes them happy.

With the price of protein right now, that makes sense.

 

[lunker99]

On Saturday I visited a locker to drop off a deer. I pulled around back to drag the deer into the cooler. Next to the cooler door were at least 20 sawed off buck heads. Everyone was 1 or 2 years old, not one older. This was the last weekend of gun 2, can’t imagine how many little bucks were taken overall. I wish I would have snapped a pic. IMO that’s a result of driving, sharing tags, shooting running deer and looking after. I’m not against driving, but this is the result. We wonder why big deer are fading away.

Interesting take as this thread seems that most people are stating the deer hunting isn't as good as it used to while comparing it to a time period when deer drives were the primary method of hunting. Maybe the deer farming and blind sitting approach isn't the best thing for a quality deer herd since it seems the quality of hunting has dropped as this method has taken over, lol.

Smart enough to realize many things have changed over the years such as habitat, disease, technology, farming practices, etc. Not many groups left in our area doing drives anymore compared to the old days and trying to blame the few people left that hunt this way is getting old.