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Thoughts on deer numbers...

I would agree that the numbers seen are down a lot. When you sit in places that have been and should be a interstate for deer travel and you see one if any go through something is up. Talking to friends in northern Iowa where the habitat is less than that in the south the farmers have told me that they saw 2-3 deer all harvest. That's nuts when you consider how much ground they cover. Another issue in my opinion would be some habitat issues in certain areas of the state. When you are located in an area with limited timber to start with, to tear down that timber to get another acre to farm is tough. I know they are making their living on that land and I respect that and appreciate the work they do, but when you reduce the habitat to fence rows and a few thickets hear and there it has to make an impact somehow. Just my two cents.
 
Funny charbs, but I thought the same thing...and this is coming from someone with quite a bit of cover around...but it reminds me of where I grew up in the 80's in central Indiana, and they started doing fence row to fence row. There are a lot of little "woodlots" being cleared right now around here...and I can't imagine if this was in an area with already marginal cover.
 
Numbers down "Plain & Simple" I haven't even come close to seeing deer like in the past. It is a bummer no doubt. This should go on the other post about Future of Iowa, but now should be the time to bring in all the NR's and take all their money and hope they see nothing and maybe then they won't want to come here anymore. Nothing against NR's but this is all a Money Game with the DNR.
 
Way down from last year. Last year was bad too. Louisa County.

Got alot less trailcamera pics the last two years. Didn't even see any places where the deer had knocked down the corn at all this year.

I wish they would ease up on the number of doe tags.
 
This may sound stupid, but I hunt down in SW Iowa..and alot of the farmers shoot deer year round to protect there crops. They feel like the deer eat to much corn. That right there is where the problem is. These old time farmers dont know any better. I was walking a cornfield where there were about 2 acres knocked flat, and all the corn stripped. Well of course, the farmers were concerned with deer. I told them, you realize that the deer wont knock it down, and of course, they wanted to argue. So a few trail cam pics, and a videos of hundreds of coons, they changed there minds. The coon down there are terrible, and I dont think the people realize it. The deer are down, way down. I think they should dump the rifle season, and dump alot of the doe tags. Basically all IMO.. Im not here to argue, and anyone that wants to get started, PM me so not everyone has to be involved in a pissing match. Thanks
 
I'm just asking...when did guys who spend time in the field (who know the difference between coon damage, and deer damage) get "reduced" to IMO...you are not an IMO...you are someone who understands what is goingd on!!!! Sooo why don't you need a $27 coon tag, unless you are a NR to get rid of the problem. Folks...please remember...this is the same DNR who was claiming there were NO cougars in IOWA...oh wait, there was one shot in Iowa cnty. last year!!!
 
When I first bought my land in IA, the first two farmers I met gave me the story,"We shoot any deer we see, any time. Keep a rifle by the back door." I am sure this is a popular opinion amoungst crop producers in my area. The DNR in MI. used to say that they estimated as many deer were poached,,as were taken legally. This is probably the case in Iowa too. I found a very small deer carcass dumped in ditch just down the road from me, only head taken off. What was that about.? Someone wanting to mount tiny horns? Very small body for a yearling. Local butcher gave my neighbor many antlers he has collected from hunters, for a project neighbor was making. Most all little yearlings. Shame all those youngsters shot.
 
Not defending the DNR, they can defend themselves, but we have to realize that they are trying to appease a wide range people and groups. When it was decided to lower the deer herd, we were very close to having the legislature take over deer regulations, because the only people complaining were those that thought there were too many deer. Personally I'd much rather have someone in wildlife management making those decisions instead of a legislator who has a constituent that thinks there are too many deer.

I really think the DNR is hearing loud and clear that deer numbers are down from the sportsmen. Give your legislator a call and tell them the same thing you are telling the DNR. If a few key legislators get this message,it won't take long to get the word to the DNR.

We spend a lot of time complaining on forums about this issue. It doesn't take any longer to write a note to your rep or senator than it does to make a post. I promise you the results will be better. All we are doing here is preaching to the choir.
 
The deer number issue is NOT strictly an Iowa problem. Last weekend in Rock Island county, Illinois 17 first season shotgun hunters SAW ONE deer. Rock Island county is directly across the Mississippi from Muscatine.

We are looking at some REAL lean times coming up. Just like the Pheasants, there are places where there still are deer. Also, just like the Pheasants many people in the IDNR and the public wll refuse to see what is really obvious. The numbers just ain't there people!!!!!!!!!!
 
I would agree that the numbers seen are down a lot. When you sit in places that have been and should be a interstate for deer travel and you see one if any go through something is up. Talking to friends in northern Iowa where the habitat is less than that in the south the farmers have told me that they saw 2-3 deer all harvest. That's nuts when you consider how much ground they cover. Another issue in my opinion would be some habitat issues in certain areas of the state. When you are located in an area with limited timber to start with, to tear down that timber to get another acre to farm is tough. I know they are making their living on that land and I respect that and appreciate the work they do, but when you reduce the habitat to fence rows and a few thickets hear and there it has to make an impact somehow. Just my two cents.
This is not just a problem for our deer heard, but alot of our wildlife. This is also the main reason the pheasant population has been down for so many years.
 
This is not just a problem for our deer heard, but alot of our wildlife. This is also the main reason the pheasant population has been down for so many years.
I think the real problem with pheasant populations is a predator problem more than habitat. Back in the early 70's we never had ANY yotes here in eastern Iowa and there were tons of pheasants and there were also more trappers catching coons ect. I don't think we will ever see a decent population of birds ever again as long as there are yotes, hawks and coons like ticks on a sick deer. Two times I have sat in one stand where there are a 1/2 dozen roosters holed up, both mornings there were yotes after them in the mornings. :mad: I think we need a bounty on them. The DNR is doing a good job of screwing with the natural balance of our natural resources.
 
G6, the predators may take a few but it's loss of habitat that's the real problem. When you consider the 10's of thousands of acres of CRP that've been put back into production, it's no wonder populations are down. And when the habitat that's left is road ditches and other low spots, a wet spring like we had this year means no nesting spots and/or drowned chicks. Also, when the birds are concentrated into small strip and border spots, versus full fields of switchgrass, it makes it easier for predators to take them. And when Iowa has the such a small amount of public land, scattered in isolated pockets, it can't carry any significant numbers.
 
Predators and habitat go hand in hand. If there is enough QUALITY habitat predators are not as big of an issue. If there wern't as many predators the lack of quality habitat would not be as big of an issue.

They are both part of the problem. Having said that, I feel that everything is based on habitat. Others things just compound the problem of lack of habitat.
 
G6, the predators may take a few but it's loss of habitat that's the real problem. When you consider the 10's of thousands of acres of CRP that've been put back into production, it's no wonder populations are down. And when the habitat that's left is road ditches and other low spots, a wet spring like we had this year means no nesting spots and/or drowned chicks. Also, when the birds are concentrated into small strip and border spots, versus full fields of switchgrass, it makes it easier for predators to take them. And when Iowa has the such a small amount of public land, scattered in isolated pockets, it can't carry any significant numbers.

I know I have read multiple opinions about the loss of CRP acres negatively impacting pheasant/quail numbers, but I think there is more to that story than just the loss of acres per se. IMO, just losing CRP acres is NOT that big of a deal, provided those acres were in mature stands of brome that is. A ten year old+ brome field offers little to game birds in terms of year round cover, food and nesting habitat. "From the road", a 20 acre brome field looks like there should be some birds on it, but from a true "bird's eye view" at ground level, brome is just about as useful as asphalt. It is difficult for a gamebird to run around on the ground underneath brome and equally difficult for them to run across the top of it, it offers no food, etc.

Don't get me wrong, more CRP is better than less CRP, it is just that 5 acres of CRP in something other than brome, is better in my mind than 100 acres of CRP in a brome stand. I have had 90 acres of my own CRP now for about 10 years. It was predominantly brome, with a good amount of volunteer trees on it too, mostly cedars and scrub oaks. (A very common combination on brome CRP that is left to "nature" and given a few years.) There was little sign of gamebirds in the first few years, whether we had a wet year or dry year. The predator population was also then, like it is now, relatively high compared to long term averages.

When I began to affect the percentage of brome by burning/spraying/planting other grass species, etc, the gamebird populations had an almost immediate bounce back from essentially NO gamebird levels during the mostly pure brome stand.

Predators do get some nests and also some adult birds, and I would agree too that there are more hawks/coyotes/coons, etc, nowadays than 20+ years ago. Also, the tough winters and VERY wet springs we have been experiencing have hurt gamebird populations quite a bit. But show me a switchgrass field with some food nearby and I will guarantee that there will still be a population of pheasants.

All of that to say this...it isn't the number of acres in CRP that is most crucial, it is much more important to have the RIGHT habitat on even a much smaller number of acres. It's the old quality v. quantity argument if you ask me. Give me the quality habitat in this case. Then if we knock the predator population down some and have a few good dry springs we will have plenty of pheasants around.
 
G6, the predators may take a few but it's loss of habitat that's the real problem. When you consider the 10's of thousands of acres of CRP that've been put back into production, it's no wonder populations are down. And when the habitat that's left is road ditches and other low spots, a wet spring like we had this year means no nesting spots and/or drowned chicks. Also, when the birds are concentrated into small strip and border spots, versus full fields of switchgrass, it makes it easier for predators to take them. And when Iowa has the such a small amount of public land, scattered in isolated pockets, it can't carry any significant numbers.
I noticed the drop in pheasants way before CRP was introduced and we never had CRP back when I was talking about. Back then the pheasants nested in road ditches and strip cover more than anything, if you found a grass field back then it was loaded with birds and was like heaven for hunting. Just saying. I quit bird hunting along time ago because it was too much work to where it wasn't enjoyable anymore unfortunately. :(
 
I honestly think alot of the pheasant issue is coyotes, coon and hawks. I was hunting a buddies farm and there were 3 hawks that flew all night long about 10ft above the CRP which was about knee high. Everytime a pheasant would cackle they would key in on it. The coons are absolutely ridiculous out there as well. I have seen more coon this year than ever. Hardly anyone traps them anymore. Pheasants don't need grass to live. I know willow bottoms that are chalk full of them. We used to shoot them in our timber in the multiflora rose all the time.

Back when there were a bunch of birds for our area we didn't have CRP anywhere. Just crops fields and timber. I also think the winters, wet springs don't help as well.
 
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