Roundup Ready Corn & Soybean Food Plot

[dbltree]

Just a hint. If your looking for cheap seed beans, check your local coop right now. They sometimes have some bags left over from test plots that they can't sell, so they give away a couple bags here and there. The retailer I a currently working at has a whole pallet of plot seed still sitting around.

Good reminder...thanks! :way:

I have a question on the winter rye. Can you plant it after the bean fields have been hit with round up? And will the rye grow as the beans get taller?? Thanks

You overseed winter rye when the soybeans are starting to yellow in late August...do not do it while soybeans are growing. The rye would quickly mature and become unpalatable and then soybeans and rye would compete and yes...roundup will kill the rye.

Do NOT use forage soybeans...they will stay green and not allow you to overseed the rye, then they will turn yellow right during hunting season and deer will avoid them like the plague!

May 25th, 2012

My friend Fred sent me a few pics from his farm including his soybeans that were just coming up nicely

Fred fences his soybeans with the double electric fence and ended up with beans left over at winter's end. I told Fred that while I could be wrong...I predict that in 3-5 years he will not be able to grow beans...fence or no, why?

Fred's farm is new and last year was the first for planting food sources and Fred is doing everything right! I have been helping Fred with TSI, Edge Feathering, and radical hinging to improve his timber and mast production and create outstanding bedding and browse at the same time. He has been inter planting both oak, chestnut and browse species in the hinged areas and protecting them with Miracle tubes.

Fred also set about immediately to convert his brome CRP ground to switchgrass by frost seeding the killed sod in the winter time and now was an awesome stand of thick cover in the form of Cave In Rock switchgrass...all of which surrounds his hidden food sources.

Fred is also wise enough not to reply on one food source and by planting multiple crops in his feeding area he is feeding his deer year around. Clover, brassicas and soybeans are working for him right now and he tilled under his brassicas this spring for oats and annual clovers which are feeding deer and building soils at the same time.

This spring Fred also added fruit trees to his feeding area and all of that is going to help adapt deer to coming to this centralized, well hidden, safe and secure...feeding area and in time they will challenge the fence and wipe out his beans, which is all good of course, but something for every landowner who creates better habitat to be aware of. If you do things right, most likely soybeans and corn will eventually not be a viable option.

After a week of relentless of rain in early May, it has turned off terribly dry with many beans not planted yet. Where possible drill the beans to a depth of 1 1/2 to 2" max deep to get them in the moisture zone (normally an inch would be best)

Soybeans are more heat tolerant then corn but...as many landowners found out last winter, the deer may not hit them hard in mild winters preferring the cereal grains and clovers so be certain to do like Fred and plant multiple food sources within your feeding area...

 

[dbltree]

June 10th, 2012

A few years back when we were inundated with heavy rains literally all spring into summer...we had a farmer in the area who aerial seeded 800 acres of soybeans. The ground was so soft that some seeds went several inches deep into the soil while others laid on top but the whole mess turned into one of the best soybean crops in the area, point being that with plenty of rainfall we can often literally throw seed on top of the soil and get a great stand.

In dry years however....it is a far different story and planting seeds at a uniform depth that is in the moisture zone is critical. There are thousands of acres of very spotty corn and soybean stands across Iowa and Missouri, and the difference between drilled beans and row planted beans is obvious because the older drills are not as adept at placing seedings at a uniform depth and then covering the row like new row planters.

Imagine then how poorly stands that were broadcast and then covered with a cultipacker have been! Less then 10% germinated in one stand I have seen (planted with a Brillion seeder) and since then they replanted with a drill and even then...did not cover much of the seed, let alone get it into the moisture zone.

Should we get several inches of rain...these beans will do fine but if we get a 1/4"...it will likely spell a second round of failure

Many landowners have neither a drill nor planter but you can lightly drag or disc the bean seed in to get it within the top several inches of soil. Soybeans can be planted at 140,000 seeds (one bag) up to more then 220,000 seeds or higher so I would plant at higher rates and incorporate the seed in the 2-3" zone knowing some may not come up versus in the 1/2" to 1 1/2" depth where there may be no moisture...then cultipack to cover.

Unlike my friends back east...we are desperately hoping for substantial rainfall here in the Midwest...but barring that, I suspect these will meet the same fate as the previous seed did....

Meanwhile...my friend Fred row planted his and was blessed with enough rain to get them germinated and with any rainfall at all this summer they should do fine...

On another note...I was under the impression that Yield Gard seed corn would provide protection for more then just corn borers, including black cutworms but my friend Brian (who helps manage a large ag co-op and therefore must be able to provide accurate information to farmers with millions invested in crops) reminded me that such is not the case,

Here is an link to some Yield Gard seed...

YieldGard Corn Borer

Speed reading is not the best in cases like this because I missed some key words that remind us that sometimes insecticides are necessary to control other pests.

Effective, consistent protection from corn borer
Whole-season, in-plant corn borer protection allows corn to maintain healthier stalks
More nutrient and moisture uptake means greater yeild potential
Convenience of reduced insecticide handling
YieldGard® Corn Borer seed corn can be offered with secondary pest control for protection against black cutworm, wireworm, white grub, seed corn maggot and early flea beetle

Black cutworms have been wreaking havoc on corn in many areas

Black Cutworms

Consult you extension agent or someone like Brian at an ag service for best treatement options but here are a few ideas to ask about.

Cutworm Control

The general recommendation for cutworm control involves use of a postemergence rescue treatment once economic levels of cutworm damage are detected. Early detection is essential. Treat if damage exceeds the threshold and cutworms are 1 inch or less in length. Cutworms longer than 1 inch likely are to pupate (i.e. cease feeding) before causing significant additional damage. If the soil surface is dry or crusted, shallow incorporation using a rotary hoe or other suitable equipment immediately before or soon after insecticide application of Lorsban 4E may improve control. Pyrethroid insecticides (e.g., Ambush, Pounce, Warrior, Asana) should not be incorporated, however.

Bt corns containing the Cry 1F protein (Herculex I and Hercules Xtra) are labeled for control of black cutworms, and will reduce injury. Other cutworm species which overwinter as partly grown caterpillars may not be controlled adequately.

Preventive treatments applied at or before planting generally have given erratic control, especially where cutworm numbers have been high. These include granular and liquid insecticides as well as systemic seed treatments containing neonicotinoid insecticides, such as Cruiser (thiamethoxam) or Poncho (clothianidin). Also, most fields do not have a cutworm problem every year, so preventive treatments are often unnecessary. Planting time treatments may be advisable if replanting is necessary due to cutworm damage and cutworms are 1 inch or less in length.

Another question I have been asked frequently is...

If I use atrazine on my corn and the corn fails (is devoured by deer) can I plant brassicas (or other crops) this summer/fall

There are too many variables in that question to answer it accurately and across the board because soil texture/type, amount of rainfall, atrazine application rate and tillage methods all can have an impact on how long it remains effective. The potential exists for at least partial control to last well into the following spring so applying atrazine in May may make planting brassicas in July a highly improbable scenario...herbicides like Dual II Magnum/Cinch might be a safer option if you fear your corn may be wiped out by high deer populations....or you may wish to do as I have done and avoid the problems that plague corn and soybean plantings and switch to a less problematic crop rotation where pests are kept at bay naturally and herbicides are not necessary....

Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks

Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests

Brassicas in 45% of plot

Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#

Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)

Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot

Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 80-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Austrian Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre
Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre

Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28

Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year

 

[dbltree]

The case against corn

There are it seems some obvious relations between habitat and wildlife, especially whitetails...great habitat equals high deer populations and poor habitat in turn means low deer numbers. That of course goes for all wildlife and poor habitat is usually the cause for low populations of almost any wildlife species, but SE Iowa has fantastic habitat overall, not only for whitetails but many species of other wildlife. It has the perfect mix of timber and crop land combined with CRP prairiegrass that helps create a wildlife mecca, with well managed properties holding incredible numbers of whitetails. The opposite is true in areas of Iowa that have only crop land, almost no timber and no prairiegrass means little wildlife of any kind and nearly every state has both premium habitat and "wildlife wastelands".

With so much variance in habitat it goes without saying that landowners across the country will experience all kinds of highs and lows regarding deer numbers, what one finds to be true...another may find just the opposite....and so it goes...

All of that said, you begin to see why some can grow corn and beans and many others cannot...and frankly...those that can probably have low deer densities because their habitat is sub par or they simply are not blessed with very much cover such as in the wide open crop land areas of Iowa.

I have shared that I no longer grow corn and beans and that attempting to is a futile waste of time and effort not only on my own farm but on all the farms on which I help manage the habitat. Even when hundreds of acres of crops are grown on some of these farms, they experience serious losses due to wildlife damage, because out habitat is outstanding for more then just whitetails.

You know you have a problem when deer decimate corn before the 4th of July and my friend Jordan posted this pic of some of their corn in western Iowa....

This is ag corn on a farm near my home where I was planting NWSG and stopped to take a pic of the deer damage

It is common to go for a drive and see deer standing out in corn fields pulling the centers out of chest high corn and I snapped a pic of this doe as I drove by with the tractor

It takes a minimum of 15-20 acres of corn in my area to have enough to stand the pressure from deer and then...the coons and squirrels have a go at it and in many cases crop insurance is used to cover the losses. This field is also commercial corn and has been heavily damaged in many areas of the field.

It's a nice problem...having such great habitat that it harbors high numbers of whitetails that are adapted to living there and taking advantage of whatever crop is grown. If you can grow corn and beans and it is not decimated...you have low deer numbers and that usually translates to poor cover...improve your cover and things will often change rapidly.

In every case here I have been far more successful planting a combination of crops that can take the abuse, yield high tonnage, high quality food sources that can keep up with higher deer densities. I would also add that on every property we have taken good habitat and made it fantastic by utilizing a number of improvements including TSI, hinging, tree planting, screening, establishing NWSG so whitetails do not leave for any reason.

If you can grow corn and beans...by all means do so but...keep in mind that the fact that you can may not necessarily be....a good thing....

Consider the following options if corn and beans aren't working for you...

Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks

Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests

Brassicas in 45% of plot

Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#

Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)

Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot

Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 80-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Austrian Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre
Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre

Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28

Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year

 

[dbltree]

July 7th, 2012

While I no longer plant soybeans or corn as a part of my or my clients habitat programs, I am often asked to plant it for others. With free RR soybean seed available it's hard to find a less expensive crop to plant and though a year old, the seed is usually still 80-85% germ and all top of the line seed.

most soybean seed is now sold in 140,000 seeds per bag units...

but 165,000 to 220,000 seeds per acre are the norm on good soils surrounded by good cover

Some leftover seed is still in "seeds per pound" so multiply that number by 50 to determine how many seeds per acre.

Large fields of soybeans can tolerate heavy grazing

and drilled beans can handle deer pressure a little better then row planted

But in fields smaller then 6 acres in my area....regardless of how many seeds you plant or method of planting, deer quickly wipe them out!

Planting soybeans in small hidden fields is almost always an exercise in futility as even a small number of deer can quickly wipe out the beans

It doesn't matter if they are grain or forage beans, they simply can not tolerate the pounding they will receive and the landowner ends up being disappointed and frustrated.

In areas with low deer numbers (usually because of limited or poor quality cover) or where large fields of soybeans are planted with or adjacent to the plot, soybeans can survive but then...if the winter is mild, landowners will again be disappointed and frustrated by minimal usage.

That deer eat soybeans is a given but it is a myth that they have any magical attractions or more drawing power that other crops available to us. Driving down the road deer are obvious in ag fields, regardless of the crop type and that mistakenly leads people to believe that deer "prefer" that crop be it beans, corn, alfalfa or wheat (to name a few that are common)

In truth however deer are opportunistic feeders, seldom traveling more then a 1/2 mile from their bedding area to feed. They adapt to taking advantage of ag crops only because they have little other choice but can just as easily be adapted to feeding on other food sources planted closer to premium bedding cover. Creating great whitetail cover

Use caution when considering soybeans or corn and if you incorporate them into your plan, be sure to utilize clovers, overseeding winter rye etc. to provide year around food sources and above all...be prepared to abandon soybeans as you improve your cover. more/better cover means more/better deer and by year 3 generally growing soybeans in a hidden field will become impossible. At that point you may wish to consider a crop rotation that feeds deer year around, build soils, lowers herbicide and fertilizer requirements and...can take the heat of heavy grazing....

Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks

Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests

Brassicas in 45% of plot

Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#

Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)

Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot

Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 80-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Austrian Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre
Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre

Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28

Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year

 

[Daver]

FWIW, I tried two bean plots this year, each about an acre apiece. Well between the lack of rain and the deer pressure I have two moonscapes out there now! (These aren't my only plots, but I had a couple of spots that I thought I would try them, realizing that I may be replanting yet this summer due to heavy browse pressure, etc.)

Now if we had received normal rains might these plots have been more useful? Possibly, but I can't even be sure about that. Even free beans are just about not worth it. In smaller plots anyway.

I was hoping to provide some grain options for a small, but growing population of pheasants that I have now. I think I will try milo next year for the pheasant/turkey, other than that for the deer it is Dbltree rotation all the way. :way:

 

[mshm99]

I've learned small soybean plot lesson........don't do it! That said,I've got some left over seed. Would it hurt anything if mixed some beans in with my spring oats and crimsom clover,next spring,just to use them up?

Mike

 

[dbltree]

I've learned small soybean plot lesson........don't do it! That said,I've got some left over seed. Would it hurt anything if mixed some beans in with my spring oats and crimsom clover,next spring,just to use them up?

Mike

Nope...not a thing but they can also be added to the fall rye mix as "deer candy" along with the peas...

 

[BuxtonHunter]

Last year I was able to actually just broadcast RR Soybeans and RR corn together and drag them in with a harrow section. Being I do all my plots with an Atv this 2 acre plot has been by far my best. The broadcasting method is not ideal but worked well last year with all of the early rain. This year none of my plots look that great because of the lack of rain, and I didn't get any left over beans from the local farmers this year. I planted a lot of clover (hoping for rain).

 

[Sligh1]

No "Skip" is not me for those who inquired Maybe change your name to "The other Skip" or "Skip #2"?!?! ha.
With your corn & bean combo plot- did you have plenty of corn come season?

 

[Hardwood11]

Beans

I would agree you need a large bean field to withstand heavy browse. The best way to do it is if you have a larger field ca sh rented and have the farmer leave 3-4 acres in exchange for reduced rent...that way the deer cannot concentrate on your specific acres until after harvest.

 

[dbltree]

July 25th, 2012

My friend Fred sent me a pic of his fenced soybeans....I told him forget the deer, get the combine in there this fall...with beans at record high prices that stuff is like gold!

Unfortunately because of the seriousness of the drought, even though soybeans look green and healthy they are under extreme duress and have begun to flower and without substantial rainfall soon may be full of empty pods or at best, BB sized beans. Fred has other food sources such as clover in his feeding area and with other ag crops on his farm has thus far not had a problem with deer challenging his E fence, but in time this will no doubt change. We have been doing radical hinging around his feeding area and Fred has established a beautiful stand of CIR switchgrass around the FA as well...all of which will over time help adapt deer to feeding there and eventually beans...may not be an option.

In most cases I run into this...hidden soybean fields ravaged and demolished by mid summer

and this is just one of the reasons I don't care for soybeans and corn

not only are they easily destroyed well before hunting season but any grain may be quickly stripped within weeks rendering the feeding area ineffective and useless

If the winter is mild (as it was in 2011/2012) whitetails may turn up their noses at soybeans altogether and many people found that their soybeans were largely untouched, while their rye and brassicas were heavily foraged. Having compared food sources, side by side on dozens of feeding areas on many farms...I have found that it is a myth that any certain food source has the ability to draw deer for miles...it simply is not true. Whitetails seldom travel more then a 1/2 mile (with exceptions in the snow belts of the Great Lakes states) from their home cover and will eat nearly anything that is close to safe cover.

Like many, I have experienced the "they won't eat my brassicas" situation until...I took away the corn and soybeans, then immediately they turned on the brassicas...same deer, same fields...something to keep in mind when deciding what might work best for you.

Fred is for now, utilizing soybeans as a part of his feeding area, clover, brassicas, over seeded rye into the beans etc. all help him provide year around food sources in ONE place and suffice it to say Fred has had some very successful hunting seasons. Choose whatever combinations will keep feed in your feeding area every day of the year and then be ready to change and adapt as deer adapt to finding their needs met in one place. The following combinations can withstand heavy grazing ,do not require fencing and little if any herbicides and have proven effective across much of the nation....

Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks

Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests

Brassicas in 45% of plot

Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#

Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)

Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot

Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 80-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Austrian Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre
Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre

Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28

Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year

 

[Daver]

Paul - this year, even more than in past years, your advice to eschew beans and corn in lieu of rye/clover, etc, has been proven in my eyes. I admit to planting some beans this year, mainly to try to get some grain for pheasants on my place, but also knowing the deer would benefit from them. Unfortunately, I have planted and then replanted and I still have no beans! Mainly due to lack of rain, but also the little bit that did grow were quickly nipped off at ground level by the local herd.

Consequently, I have had mostly bare ground then in two of my prime food plot locations from May to now nearly August.

I am not surprised then that we are not getting as many pics this summer as usual as I know my neighbor, with a 20+ acre ag bean field that is semi-secluded is. So the bucks are around, they are just not on my place so much due to a short supply of food. (My clover fields are still hanging on, but they are looking tough now too.)

I would still like to accomodate pheasants and quail, along with deer/turkey. Do you think I should just skip the beans next year and go with your rotation for deer AND a couple of plots of milo for the birds?

 

[dbltree]

I would still like to accomodate pheasants and quail, along with deer/turkey. Do you think I should just skip the beans next year and go with your rotation for deer AND a couple of plots of milo for the birds?

Yes...milo is fairly deer resistant (while growing), drought resistant and both birds and whitetails love it in the winter time. Strip plant it in your feeding area using the rye/clover/brassica combos to feed deer.

Milo needs nitrogen so one option is to plant areas that were in rye/red clover or consider adding hairy vetch to the rye/clover mix this fall and plant late May...it will lower your fertilizer costs and still get you a decent crop of milo.

WGF milo is a good choice but there are others of course, just choose grain sorghum/milo rather then forage types.:way:

 

[dbltree]

August 7th, 2012

Soybeans can be fairly drought resistant but...they have their limits and to make matters worse as the stressed plants mature they become less and less attractive to whitetails, of course that's assuming they even survive that long!

Lee and Tiffany's beans haven't fared so well...

Heat, lack of rain and grazing pressure have insured failure and these are not food plot beans!

For crops of any kind to survive severe droughts they need to be on high organic matter soils or they'll end up like these beans

In good years anyone can grow anything and look like they know what they are doing but...in tough years the weather can as they say...separate the men from the boys....

It is for this reason I prefer to work with crops that can not only survive, but thrive in tough weather and build up soils at the same time. I prefer to plant white clover versus soybeans because intense deer pressure can not wipe out good healthy clovers, but white clovers are susceptible to droughts as well...

Unless however the white clover was started in the fall with cereal rye....this clover is in the same small field as the previous pic but is healthy and thriving despite the drought simply because it is living off the water stored in massive rye root systems (now decomposing and adding OM)

The rye/clover combination has proven to be hands down the best combination for me to deal with severe drought but..."don't I have to have soybeans to hold deer?"

I reckon not...soybeans just down the road yet they seem very content to forage in my NWSG/forb mix.

These deer are feeding in a patch of oats that were baled once, re-grew, matured and other then annual weeds there is nothing else to eat (no clovers) yet surrounded by corn and...

soybeans...that they now turn up their noses at

All of that is not meant to convince anyone that they should not plant beans, only to continue to show that there are better, more effective options that allow you to grow more feed on less ground at a far lower cost and in so doing increase the amount of cover on your farm.

Instead of planting 10 acres of soybeans to feed your deer, 3 acres of other crops can be planted and the other 7 planted to switchgrass (for example) and that is just enough to potentially hold a mature buck.

Right now spider mites are having a field day in the soybean fields forcing producers to throw good money after bad in a last ditch hope of salvaging a crop...IF they get rain. In decades of growing clovers I have yet to experience any major damage to either red or white clovers which does not mean of course that depending on your geographic location that you may...just sayin'...

Soybeans aren't the only thing fried around here...1000's of acres of cornfields are...toast....

Plant whatever combination of crops work best for you in your area and if that includes soybeans...add them in addition to other crops such as those listed below and provide plenty of diversity in your habitat program....

Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks

Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests

Brassicas in 45% of plot

Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#

Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)

Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot

Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 80-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Austrian Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre
Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre

Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28

Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year

 

[dbltree]

September 9th, 2012

I frequently warn area landowners against planting soybeans and corn in hidden areas (where plots should be planted) because they are doomed from the say they were planted. Deer can easily wipe out as much as 10 acres of beans long before the end of summer, let alone by hunting season. Few however heed my warnings and thinking that there is some advantage to planting beans...proceed anyway which leads to this...

In this case 4 acres of beans...wiped out!

Bean plants eaten to the ground!

Expensive summer forage at best!

often, as in this case I am asked to go back and no-till plant the rye/oat/pea mix to insure that the landowner has a fall/winter food source...here is the same field a week after planting

Plenty of outstanding feed that unlike beans or corn cannot be wiped out and will not leave the field barren of food mid winter

Unlike beans or corn, the rye will continue to grow...they can eat it to the dirt and it will keep growing and will do so down to 34 degrees...something other cereals cannot do, thus insuring an all winter food source

The red clover is tiny now, but in the spring it will spring to life and provide a spring/summer food source until we repeat the cereal planting....no worries about high deer numbers!

It is a myth, or misconception (and one I am guilty of myself) that one needs soybeans or corn to compete but that is simply not true most of the time. Whitetails are opportunistic feeders and will readily feed on the food source closest to their bedding area provided it is safe and secure. Knowing that, I have revised my strategies over the years and now plant food sources that provide year around food sources that hold whitetails on each and every farm where I plant them and they never, ever wipe them out or are left with any empty "dirt plot"

I do like a challenge, including those situations where I entrusted with holding deer for one of my landowners that may have land adjacent to another, each trying to attract whitetails from the adjoining property...after all, few of us have not been in that situation, so i enjoy seeing the year around food sources I plant....draw deer from "across the fence" where there may be standing beans or corn left as the sole attractant.

Unfortunately Lee and Tiffany's soybeans don't present much of a challenge this year....

Oh well...there is always next year and I am quite certain they will be successful...beans or no...

Remember if you do have soybeans, you can extend the life of the feeding area into spring by overseeding winter rye at 50-150#'s per acre just as leaves are starting to turn. This pic shows later planted beans in a waterway that was tiled that are still dark green and shading the soil while the background beans are well on their way to leaf turn/drop. When the first few leaves start to yellow...broadcast the cereal rye seed into the standing beans...

Soybeans may or may not be for you but before you try them make sure you have other food sources in the same field to help keep hungry deer from wiping them out. In most situations the following crop combinations will be every bit as attractive and then some...maturing soybeans become less attractive and cannot compete with lush, highly palatable rye, oats and peas.

Keep in mind also that as beans begin to yellow, deer will not ouch them and unless the winter is severe they will often choose green food sources over the beans....things to keep in mind when making management decisions for next year.....

Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks

Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests

Brassicas in 45% of plot

Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#

Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)

Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot

Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 80-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Austrian Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre
Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre

Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28

Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year

 

[dbltree]

September 19th 2012

I always look forward to crop updates from my friend Mike up in WI, he always does a fantastic job even in tough drought years such as 2012. Yields vary widely of course depending on soil type but over all they did pretty well and Mike gets top score for planting a diverse array of crops that will help keep his whitetails fed year around and...help provide some insurance that if one crop fails, he's not up a creek without a paddle.

Corn, soybeans, alfalfa, brassicas, clovers and the rye combination cover Mikes farm....

His soybeans are early maturing beans, some of which he overseed winter rye into as the leaves started turning and all of which will have fully turned and dried down by hunting season....well done in that regard.

Mike asks me from time to time..."what do you think? what can I change or better?" but with his beautiful array of year around food sources it's hard to find any glaring problems....with his crops...

Note the lush rye/radish/clover that is feeding deer now and will continue to when all the corn and beans are long gone

but crops alone do not create great habitat and many times, the farm and landowner may not easily allow for change. In Mikes case what his farm is critically short on is cover so he must rely on neighboring timber to hold deer and he knows that when the crops are gone those deer will be taking advantage of his food sources.

In a perfect world, if Mike said..."Paul...draw up a road map to a perfect whitetail farm and I'll make the necessary changes"...I would suggest conifer/shrub thickets of perhaps 10 acres in size on hillsides and poor quality soils. One thicket would make a substantial difference and more/larger thickets would make a dramatic difference.

Such changes of course are not always realistic or feasible but for those who have purchased a farm solely for the purpose of managing/hunting whitetails...leaving it as is is rarely the best option.

I would note here the glaring difference then between Mikes farm and mine....and the reasons he can grow corn and beans and I can not....cover! No cover = few deer and low deer numbers mean little if any threat to growing crops and in Mikes case a mild winter may mean he will actually have grain still standing in the fields next spring. On farms in my area, thick cedar and brush filled draws and oak hickory timber create massive amounts of high quality cover and copious amounts of whitetails that in turn...lay waste to conventional ag crops often by the 1st of July.

Point being here that it is cover, not food that each of us should be working towards if managing for whitetails is our primary goal.

A good friend of mine asked recently..."I can't believe your not going to plant any soybeans...what about when the snow is deep?" to which I replied that I have never had soybeans standing in winter time simply because they are always wiped out yet the same deer stayed in the same plots eating brassicas, rye and clover...often digging thru a foot of snow to get to the food.

After all...what do deer in Saskatchewan, North Dakota, northern Minnesota, New York along the lake (to name a few) where growing soybeans and corn may be impossible...do? They survive and thrive because they adapt to their habitat and live primarily (as God intended) off from browse.

That of course brings us back to the most critical need on our hunting properties regardless of where it may be geographically....COVER and cover does not mean wide open timber! Whitetail cover means thick, brushy, dense cover with plentiful browse via a diverse array of forbs, shrubby, early successional habitat.

Things to think about when planing improvements to your own farm and remember...there are many CRP programs that might allow you to plant HEL to trees and shrubs AND get paid a rental income for the next 15 to 30 years!

Mikes crops are incredible, even in a drought year and as always I appreciate seeing his beautiful crops from up WI way :way:

 

[BuyMeOne]

Too many deer!

July 7th, 2012

While I no longer plant soybeans or corn as a part of my or my clients habitat programs, I am often asked to plant it for others. With free RR soybean seed available it's hard to find a less expensive crop to plant and though a year old, the seed is usually still 80-85% germ and all top of the line seed.

most soybean seed is now sold in 140,000 seeds per bag units...

but 165,000 to 220,000 seeds per acre are the norm on good soils surrounded by good cover

Some leftover seed is still in "seeds per pound" so multiply that number by 50 to determine how many seeds per acre.

Large fields of soybeans can tolerate heavy grazing

and drilled beans can handle deer pressure a little better then row planted

But in fields smaller then 6 acres in my area....regardless of how many seeds you plant or method of planting, deer quickly wipe them out!

Planting soybeans in small hidden fields is almost always an exercise in futility as even a small number of deer can quickly wipe out the beans

It doesn't matter if they are grain or forage beans, they simply can not tolerate the pounding they will receive and the landowner ends up being disappointed and frustrated.

In areas with low deer numbers (usually because of limited or poor quality cover) or where large fields of soybeans are planted with or adjacent to the plot, soybeans can survive but then...if the winter is mild, landowners will again be disappointed and frustrated by minimal usage.

That deer eat soybeans is a given but it is a myth that they have any magical attractions or more drawing power that other crops available to us. Driving down the road deer are obvious in ag fields, regardless of the crop type and that mistakenly leads people to believe that deer "prefer" that crop be it beans, corn, alfalfa or wheat (to name a few that are common)

In truth however deer are opportunistic feeders, seldom traveling more then a 1/2 mile from their bedding area to feed. They adapt to taking advantage of ag crops only because they have little other choice but can just as easily be adapted to feeding on other food sources planted closer to premium bedding cover. Creating great whitetail cover

Use caution when considering soybeans or corn and if you incorporate them into your plan, be sure to utilize clovers, overseeding winter rye etc. to provide year around food sources and above all...be prepared to abandon soybeans as you improve your cover. more/better cover means more/better deer and by year 3 generally growing soybeans in a hidden field will become impossible. At that point you may wish to consider a crop rotation that feeds deer year around, build soils, lowers herbicide and fertilizer requirements and...can take the heat of heavy grazing....

If you cannot plant 6 acres of soybeans without having them wiped out the problem is not soybeans...the problem is too many deer. I have planted two acres of soybeans with them going to full maturity and having standing beans through the gun season in Wisconsin without having them wiped out...but I also don't see 30 deer on a field at a time. If I did, the solution to the problem would not be adjusting food plot methods but in harvesting does in a drastic way. I agree with many of your thoughts, and have learned quite a bit actually on this thread, but it seems to me based on what I have read over the now 35+ pages of posts that you have too many deer. We had similar problems years ago and had to focus intensely on doe harvest. Now, we can plant corn, beans, or anything else and have great results. And, because our doe family group numbers are down, we have more bucks moving in and setting up their home ranges on our property. Just sayin.

 

[Sligh1]

If you cannot plant 6 acres of soybeans without having them wiped out the problem is not soybeans...the problem is too many deer. I have planted two acres of soybeans with them going to full maturity and having standing beans through the gun season in Wisconsin without having them wiped out...but I also don't see 30 deer on a field at a time. If I did, the solution to the problem would not be adjusting food plot methods but in harvesting does in a drastic way. I agree with many of your thoughts, and have learned quite a bit actually on this thread, but it seems to me based on what I have read over the now 35+ pages of posts that you have too many deer. We had similar problems years ago and had to focus intensely on doe harvest. Now, we can plant corn, beans, or anything else and have great results. And, because our doe family group numbers are down, we have more bucks moving in and setting up their home ranges on our property. Just sayin.

A lot of that is true BUT, in some parts of Southern Iowa, what you mention is not possible. You can kill and kill BUT if your neighbors are full of deer, it fills right back up. Think, if you own 160 acres BUT every other guy's land is full of deer, you could shoot them all but it ain't gonna fix the problem. own a 1000 acres in Iowa in the pockets of high population, could be a full time job killing all those does. In WI- I know for a fact it's much more do-able. You guys have been beyond aggressive at reducing #'s, most areas I hear about are decimated. Some good pockets but I see & hear of very few that even come close to the hot pockets of S Iowa. (and unfortunately, there's a lot of Iowa now that's the exact opposite and more like WI- decimated. Still pockets in S iowa that are very high).

All I'm saying is, in the high density pockets, shooting more does won't fix your problem in most cases, sure helps but you are fighting a losing battle. You still need to do your best BUT you either gotta increase field size immensely or plant stuff that deer don't wipe out (like DBLTREE is showing).

The other problem in IA, the high density areas.... Beans might be ok the 1st year you do plots, say a 4 acre plot. Then, year after year you have food there, improve your cover and the deer know there's year round food in XYZ location- all the sudden 4 acres gets wiped out where it once did not. I am still a bean-lover BUT I also have a lot of acres to work with. I had ONE field I did bean on beans from last year to this- it was a 10 acre field - YES, 10 ACRES. and YES the drought didn't help 2nd year. 1st year, I had beans to combine. This year, it was August 1 and you could not find even a PLANT, not a stem, certainly not a leaf and obviously not one pod even close to forming. They literally ate the beans to the dirt, no joke or exaggeration. Thankfully, on my other bean plots, they butted up against my Ag-beans & with horrible drought will likely make around 25-30 bushels per acre- lower because of drought, not deer though. I did have a lot for bean plots, I mean a lot of acres BUT I'd say the average guy on the average size farm with medium to high density & secluded location better think real hard about trying beans and I'd do the Dbltree mix 10-1 in most those cases. Beans are 1 of about 5 plot types of my farm BUT I sure understand a lot of guys skipping them. I absolutely will NEVER put a corn plot in again BTW as a foodplot- way too many better options, easier, safer, cheaper, non-failure risking, more desirable, etc.

 

[JNRBRONC]

in some parts of Southern Iowa, what you mention is not possible. You can kill and kill BUT if your neighbors are full of deer, it fills right back up. Think, if you own 160 acres BUT every other guy's land is full of deer, you could shoot them all but it ain't gonna fix the problem. own a 1000 acres in Iowa in the pockets of high population, could be a full time job killing all those does.
All I'm saying is, in the high density pockets, shooting more does won't fix your problem in most cases, sure helps but you are fighting a losing battle. You still need to do your best BUT you either gotta increase field size immensely or plant stuff that deer don't wipe out (like DBLTREE is showing).

Aren't you always talking "herd management"? Which a good plan includes harvesting deer to get the numbers in balance with the habitat?

Here, you are basically stating you are giving up on the herd population side of the management plan and instead concentrating on increasing "habitat"?

Seems like a slippery slope to me. Where is it gonna end? You have limited food plot area for an ever increasing herd......

 

[dbltree]

we can plant corn, beans, or anything else and have great results

I think the point you are missing is that you don't need to plant corn and soybeans and in fact they are poor options both for the soil and adapting deer to feeding in one place year around. I plant crops that can handle intense grazing pressure not always because of too many deer but because I have increased the carrying capability by improving the bedding habitat...something you make no mention of.

I don't want fewer deer I want a good buck to doe ratio...in high numbers! If you desire few deer that is certainly your prerogative...what suits me may not someone else so there is no one size fits all to habitat and whitetail management.

Having few deer = poor habitat, having 30 does and 2 bucks = poor deer management....having 30 does and 20 bucks = great habitat and deer management and that is the option I prefer and I suspect most of the landowners following my threads...in which case...corn and soybeans will not be an option.

Shooting your way to the ability to grow corn and soybeans...just so one can grow them....doesn't appeal to me but thanks for sharing your thoughts on the subject....:way: