Switchgrass

[dbltree]

Seeded some waterways to CIR a couple years ago for a friend and had to attempt a spring kill of the cool season grasses which never turns out well.

Too much dormant seed and plants in April and despite spraying twice during April with gly, the cool seasons returned to compete with switchgrass.

Some switch was barely peeking thru this April when I was able to spray so I sprayed one side with gly/oust/atrazine and one with only oust and atrazine.

Forgot to take a pic of the gly treated strip but it's clean and the switch is coming up fine but i did snap a pic of the Oust/Atrazine only strip.

I was using a boomless sprayer and the farmer who rents the field had mowed and baled the whole field including the waterway so I was a little uncertain how wide it was.

This is interesting because obviously this combination was pretty effective at controlling the cool seasons and the switch strip (narrower then the spray pattern) is clearly evident. Notice the switch standing at the very far end where it was uncut last summer.

Atrazine alone would not have been effective but Oust is very powerful and certainly did the trick here without any harm to this established switchgrass.

Oust is $5.90 an ounce at Townsend chemical and available in as little as 2 ounce increments so it's well within the reach of even small landowners.

Oust works well combined with gly for killing grasses the fall before and obviously works well to "clean up" established stands but I'm still testing safe levels for weed control the seeding year.

I used 2 ounces per acre here but one ounce might be plenty on light soils...:way:

I have labels and source links on the first page of this thread...

 

[ccash]

great info wanted to thank everyone. my frost seeded switch is about 10" where I disked up the ground and my killed sod seeded switch is just popping up. my second year switch is knee deep and starting to get thick didn't use atrazine till this year. my 4 year old stand done the old way is on pare with my second year switch hight wise but not as thick not even close. I did hit it with gly and atrazine this april. Big Thanks to dbltree and all others.

 

[dbltree]

Glad your plantings were successful! :way:

 

[ccash]

just wondering how should my switch look to be on track for a good tall and thick stand this year. seems to be way ahead in the disked ground and way behind in the sprayed ground. I reckon the ground warmed up sooner but I also know that the sod killed ground will hold moisture better. Also got a little better weed controll in the disked ground. still got good controll on the sod killed ground but have some goldenrod. don;t see it as a real threat long term but it could set me back some. one thing I noticed is on the disked ground the switch lookes greener. I kinda wonder if the dead straw on the ground is tying up some nitrogen.

 

[dbltree]

If you have good weed control it should all be 4-5' tall this fall and looking back thru this thread you'll see many pictures of dormant seeded switchgrass in late August to give you an idea. :way:

 

[Qdmaer]

2yr old switch, Thanks Dbltree for the advice

:way:

 

[dbltree]

Sweet! Nice work on the switch! :way:

 

[dbltree]

This is a waterway planted to switchgrass that I sprayed with a combination of atrazine and Oust XP in April and it's about 95% clean with only a smidge of brome and fescue at this point. The surrounding cool season grasses are clearly absent in the treated waterway.

This is a spring sprayed waterway using atrazine and gly where heavy spring rains have literally washed the atrazine downhill. It's a very steep waterway on HEL so I'm just going to use clipping until the switch gets established enough to hold the soil but you can see it has all kinds of foxtail and weeds coming up at this point that would make it nearly impossible to identify switchgrass.

This is some Big Bluestem that is easier to indentify.

Established Indiangrass after having been burned in late April(pics taken in late June)

Established switchgrass also after burning in late April

already showing seedheads

We have recieved 200% of normal rainfall here in SE Iowa, ALL of which has come in May and June causing severe leaching of nitrogen, abnormal cooling of soils and literally drowning crops like this corn.

The completely saturated soils have the same effect on new switchgrass seed/seedlings that are drowning in water. Seed is slow to germinate because of abmormally cool soil because water keeps soil cooler then the air. Bacterial infections are killing crops and may also be having an effect on young NWSG seedlings in saturated soils.

In short this is a very unusal year in IA, MO, ILL and NE that will cause new seedings to exhibit slow or delayed germination and growth until we get some hot dry weather that is typical of what NWSG thrives in.

Landowners with sandy soils in areas with far less rainfall will mosy likely see very different results. Friends who live back east and have land in Iowa tell me their eastern dormant seeded swithgrass is thriving while their seedings in Iowa have almost no growth. They purchased the seed from the same sources and planted in the same manner using the same herbicides so it's important to understand that extreme weather can have a detrimental effect some years and cause a wide array of results.

We have a full week of sun forecasted for the first time since April...the kind that warm season grasses thrive on so hopefully that will spur growth in the midwest....

 

[dbltree]

I took some more pics of switchgrass and foxtail using the macro lense to better see the difference.

Foxtail on the left and established switchgrass on the right

Notice the joint on the switch (timothy and other grasses also have this)

Switch hair

Switchgrass root base

Foxtail

I have mentioned the extreme rainfall in much of the midwest that has devastated hundreds of thousands of acres of crops. We have recieved 200% of normal in 60 days which not only completely saturates soils, suffucating many plants like corn and causing a cooling effect on the soil.

Switchgrass needs warm soils and thrives in hot humid conditions but even when air temps rise the waterlogged soils stay cooler then normal and that has in turned slowed germination and growth of new switch seedlings.

Anyone with heavy clay soils like I have is likely to find things way behind schedule and mine is just beginning to come up

This was thick heavy old sod last fall and killed with a combination of Oust XP, gly and crop oil and then resprayed with atrazine in late April.

The crop field next to it has soybeans no-tilled into to it and because of heavy rains not sprayed when this pic was taken but the difference is pretty dramatic

The corn cobs are there only because the field is feet away and coons dragged them out there last fall but this area has to my knowledge never been tilled.

I cannot say that there is not a stray crabgrass or foxtail in any of these pics but based on the pic above I find it unlikely that there are very many grasses in these pics other then switchgrass knowing the potency of Oust XP.

Since the Oust provides strong residual control spraying with gly this spring was not needed and i would add that in all the years of using Oust on tree plantings i have never had any foxtail reappear. Pigweed seems to be the only weak spot if Oust is used at lower rates or not combined with aother herbicide such as atrazine or simazine.

I need magnifying glasses to read or to see the hair on adult switchgrass so I cannot say at what point the young switch will exhibit "hairs" but that's something I need to determine to better help other identify their grasses.

When using 2-4D I would use lower rates on young switch with 3-4 leaves(read the label as if using on oats for example) while older switch that is 18-24" high can probably stand a little higher does.

This is another switchgrass water way that I sprayed with 1 quart gly, 2 ounces Oust XP and 2 1/2 quarts of atrazine when some switch was barely peeking thru but not yet unfurled in mid April.

It looked like this afterwords

and looks like this now

I frost seeded that waterway without having first killed the sod and then sprayed it twice in April with gly. Some fescue and brome were dormant and came back to haunt the situation so this spring I nuked the CSG for good!

These pictures illustrate how deadly Oust XP is because I tried the same thing last spring with atrazine and it was a waste of time!

I'll see how it fills in this summer and frost seed any bare spots this winter to fill it in if needed.

For 6-12 bucks an acre Oust XP can provide awesome weed control in switchgrass and Big Bluestem plantings but to be safe apply it in the fall on new seedings. It's very safe to apply in the spring on established fields andI have literally doused some dormant plants and it had no effect.

I did one test spraying with Oust on a new seeding but it's too early to tell what if any effect it had and the label says to wait two months before seeding switchgrass so that makes fall application perfect! Oust is not restricted, it's available in small quanities from Townsend Chemical and it's inexpensive at $12 an acre max!

Use Oust...kiss your foxtail problems good bye without having to spend a fortune on expensive herbicide. A friend of mine sprayed on field with Oust last fall and the other with gly only. This spring he was amazed at the lack of weeds in his switchgrass planting compared to the gly only treated field.... :way:

 

[dbltree]

My friend Paul sent me some pics of his 2nd year switchgrass and the first one is pretty cool!

I believe Paul used Simazine on some and Atrazine on other stands with pretty equal results on his lighter sandy type soils.

I don't have much success with simazine on my heavy soils unless it is combined with other herbicides or I use very high rates. Atrazine is more effective but still, if applied alone it must be more then double the legal rate to be effective...

 

[dbltree]

My friend Bob in PA decided to give Oust XP a try last fall when he nuked an area to prepare for switchgrass October. He sprayed an Oust/Gly/2-4D combo and didn't spray anything this spring...here are the results:

He has some Japanese Knotweed on one side but otherwise the dormant seeded switch is very clean!

In another field that was NOT treated with Oust the fall before, it quickly became infested with weeds, so he tried a Gramoxone & Oust combo about the time the switch was ready to germinate and it appears he killed everything in that field!

The label says to allow 3 months after spraying 2 ounces of Oust before switch would be germinating so spraying it the end of April is likely to kill everything as you see here.

I have sprayed one ounce of Oust in very early April on a small test strip in my seeding but it's still a little too early to tell the results so I would encourage everyone to use Oust XP in the fall at 2 ounces per acre (one ounce on sandy soils) along with gly to nuke the field before winter seeding.

You'll avoid having to use expensive post emergence herbicides to try to kill foxtail later and atrazine or simazine will be far more effective when combined with the residual effects of the Oust.

Mixed NWSG plantings might combine a fall application of Plateau and Oust but I suggest testing it yourself because I have not used that combination yet. Those with Johnson Grass or bad fescue problems might consider as much as 6-8 ounces of Oust, 2 quarts of gly and one quart of crop oil in August and then a mop op in September with gly and 6-8 ounces of Plateau (for mixed stands)

2 ounces of Oust XP fall applied does not effect switch and big bluestem and 2 ounces of early spring applied Oust (while NWSG is dormant) has no ill effects on established switch and will clean up a stand plagued invasives like goldenrod...

Call Townsend Chemical to order Oust XP (minimum order of 2 ounces at $5.90 an ounce) 1(800) 616- 4221 but do NOT apply it to growing NWSG's, use it only when they are dormant or 3 months before expected germination..:way:

 

[dbltree]

For those applying Paramount or Drive...the Paramount label says 5.3 ounces per acre although I have seen up to 8 ounces applied to switch stands.<O</O
Paramount Label<O</O
The label also calls for methylated seed oil or crop oil (MSO being preferred)and Keystone carries it if you can't find it locally.<O</O
Methylated Seed Oil<O</O
Methylated Seed Oils will provide faster leaf cuticle penetration than crop oil ...or so I have read.<O</O
SO WHAT IS AN MSO? <O</O
Someone mentioned a yellow nutsedge problem and Outrider is approved for post emergence control of johnson grass, tall fescue, yellow and purple nutsedge and quakegrass in most NWSG's at up to 2.0 ounces per acre.<O</O
Outrider Label

 

[BIGJEEPMAN]

What is this grass

I planted big bluestem , indian and cave in rock this spring. I was walking around in my planted area and found a grass type plant about 16" high and has fuzz or hair on the stem, it has four leaves ,what is this. Thanks

 

[dbltree]

I planted big bluestem , indian and cave in rock this spring. I was walking around in my planted area and found a grass type plant about 16" high and has fuzz or hair on the stem, it has four leaves ,what is this. Thanks

Sounds like it could be switchgrass but a picture would be helpful...

 

[BIGJEEPMAN]

I dont no how to get pictures from camera to computer and then to post. Most of the grasses that I planted are 6" high but that some clumps 16" , not sure how much I have like that. I did see the hair in between the stem and leave on some. I would love some pictures of small big blue and cave in rock and indian just starting out. I have read all of the posts already and know how hard it would be to go back and find what I am looking for. Thanks Aaron

 

[dbltree]

I dont no how to get pictures from camera to computer and then to post. Most of the grasses that I planted are 6" high but that some clumps 16" , not sure how much I have like that. I did see the hair in between the stem and leave on some. I would love some pictures of small big blue and cave in rock and indian just starting out. I have read all of the posts already and know how hard it would be to go back and find what I am looking for. Thanks Aaron

This is CIR switchgrass in late June

This is some Big Bluestem the first summer...it has amore fountain like appearance

There are Indiangrass seedling pics at this link:

Indiangrass Seedlings

 

[dbltree]

These pics are actually a week old now and the switch has really exploded since taking these but this is the Oust/Atrazine spring sprayed switch that had some fescue and brome still unkilled.

I had frost seeded it and attempted to spring kill the cool seasons and just didn't get a good kill but the Oust nailed that stuff for good!

Still clean as a whistle!

and there is some tillering going on so it remains to be seen if I need to frost seed a bit more seed this winter

If you have a stand of switch that needs cleaning up be it fescue or goldenrod...nuke it with 2 ounces of Oust in very early spring...problem solved!:way:

 

[schweg2]

dbltree,
I have alot of foxtail in my 2nd year stand of SG, I have been contolling the broadleafs with 2,4-D. I wanted to frost seed in some more Switch late winter/spring for some of the bare spots.

Would you recommend just leaving it until the SG goes dormant this fall and spray it with OUSt?

Thanks

 

[dbltree]

dbltree,
I have alot of foxtail in my 2nd year stand of SG, I have been contolling the broadleafs with 2,4-D. I wanted to frost seed in some more Switch late winter/spring for some of the bare spots.

Would you recommend just leaving it until the SG goes dormant this fall and spray it with OUSt?

Thanks

That would be the most economical and effective way...yes. So far I have not had a single blade of foxtail show up in Oust treated areas. The only thing that comes up sometimes is pigweed but that is easily controlled in switchgrass with 2-4D...

 

[schweg2]

I was gonna order some from Townsend now, would I need any Gly or crop oil too? Or just the Oust XP do the job this fall?
It's a small area only 2-3ac

Thanks again for all the help!