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Working The System.....

Ghost

Ghost

Life Member
I'm quite discouraged with Iowa's deer regulations this year.

I know that Mr. Suchy is here asking for our input and there is a really good dialog going on in the post "Options for 2006".

The tag options for this year seem to be more confusing than ever. I have talked to a bunch of hunters this year and
everyone of them are confused about the tag options.

There are also those hunters that are working the "Party Hunting" doe tags to the limit.

What ever is legal...right?
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If I were asked the question, "How many bucks can you legally kill in Iowa"?

I would have to answer...You can shoot as many bucks as you can come up with tags for.

I guess all I'm asking for is a little SIMPLIFICATION in the whole process.

The regulations that were set for this year reminds me of a stack of swiss cheese.

I guess I'm sounding a little "Old School" here.
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I hear ya ghost LOUD AND CLEAR! I know a guy that bought a doe tag for first season, he shot 4 bucks "Party Hunting" They didn't even fill the doe tag but it enabled him to do exactly what you said......WORK THE SYSTEM!

He has Any sex Late muzzle = buck and

shot a buck with a bow too.

Not bad
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Pupster
 
I am still waiting for the Community Colleges to start offering a class in "Deer Tag-Oligy"! It is really getting crazy with the amount of options available. It is almost comical to stand in Wal-Mart sporting goods and listen to the clerk try to explain this stuff to people, especially the old timers. We can only hope things change for the better.
 
Here in Kansas we have the oposite. You can only get 1 buck tag and that tag is equipment specific. I only bowhunt and get my "Any Deer" tag for archery which makes it impossible for me to kill a buck with a rifle or ML....

Mark...
 
I often wonder what would drive a person to need to shoot multiple bucks in a season, even if it is within the scope if not the intent of the party hunting regulations. If a hunter has the choice, then I feel he is some what morally and ethicially defficent to kill several bucks just to be able to say he did. I know that I have harped on this point before but I think it needs repeating here. We have made it some how belittling of demeaning for some hunters to harvest does. Our total concentration in deer hunting is now to see how big a buck we can harvest. Some times we have to settle for a smaller buck or even on the last day a doe. Why do so many hunters want to kill a buck to just toss the horns in the garage, or nail on a post, or sell at a swap meet? I include myself in this group, because I have never had a buck mounted, even though I have killed a couple nice ones over the years. How ever over the last years with the push for doe harvest I can honestly say if there was a choice I have taken the doe rather than an average or small buck. I have taken a couple small bucks, but only if they were the only deer to present a shot. I have been hunting deer since about 1970 and have killed between 200 to 250 deer during that time. The ratio has proably been about 8 or 9 does for every buck. Way back when I started there was a drawing for deer licenses of any kind and about 75% of those were buck only. It was special when you were able to draw an any sex tag, because that meant you had a much better chance of actually getting a deer rather than walking your butt off and only seeing does and never firing a shot. I remember the first deer I ever shot was a smaller buck and some one else in the family tagged it with their buck tag because I had an any sex tag and that gave us another chance for a deer, not necessarly another buck.

It must be a sign of age when you start to ramble and remunise. My point is that I think we should try to make deer hunting fun and excitting again and move away from the obession with horns, and in some cases almost any size horns, and be just as happy and proud to harvest a nice doe as our children were or will be when they get their first one. All this comes from a confessed meat hunter but I am just as happy with the doe as a small or mid sized buck, and usually have better eats to boot.
 
I agree.Each year it seem's to get more confusing and this year it's almost to much!We need an easier system put in place.I know they didn't try to confuse everyone with the system we have this year but when you start seperating all the counties into there own little hunting zone it really start's complicating thing's.I have also talked to people who have no idea what they could or could not purchase for tag's.
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My point is that I think we should try to make deer hunting fun and excitting again and move away from the obession with horns, and in some cases almost any size horns, and be just as happy and proud to harvest a nice doe as our children were or will be when they get their first one.

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Big bucks and big antlers is what makes it exciting and fun for some of us though.
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For me antler size is a way to create a self imposed challenge in deer hunting.

The more difficult it is to succeed the sweeter the taste of success!
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By the way Bowmaker.....I always love to read your posts!
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Does this sound right? Friend bowhunts and shotgun season one. Shoots buck with bow, has anysex tag for shotgun one that he fills with a doe, wants to go with me on Saturday for another doe but is told he can't buy anterless tag for shotgun two or late muzzleloader season. Has to wait for bonus season and the rifle season down south. He could have bought extra anterless tags for shotgun one but can't for second season?
 
Ghost, I see it both ways. The problem is people take advantage of it. The way i see it is if a guy shoots 4 bucks, then someone in his party will not be able to shoot a deer. I got doe only for 1st shotgun so i could go late muzz, and i see nothing wrong with that. Both my doe tags got filled and i am still waiting for the big buck this year. You could say the same thing about farm tags. A land owner or farmer could shoot 4 bucks if they had the chance. I hunt shotgun to fill my freezer, i hunt bow and Muzz to enjoy the outdoors.
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I see the Landowner tags abused just as much or more than the Party hunting system (even tho the party hunting is for the most part legal) . I think IA needs to have accountability on the acreage prior to issuing the tag.

The way I see the Party Hunting abused is not so much by the folks out there hunting with a group with his allotted tags but when an individual buys a tag for his wife (who stays at home and prepares lunch) The kids (who may not even step into the woods) and in some cases, folks buying tags for pets (how that is done is beyond me) These folks buy the maximum amount of tags +/- Landowner tags, then one person brings all of them into the woods and takes outbucks only in a group hunting situation. I am not picking on gun hunters here 100% because it is also done by some archery and muzzleloader hunters.

In no way am I directing this towards the folks on this site. For the most part, I am sure everyone here is ethical and hunts by the published regulations.
 
Blaster...yeah I know.
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I just think they need to make the tag options clear and simple so everyone in on the same page.

I've got a master's degree and I still prefer the old method with two boxes...one for zone number and one for season choice!
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When I first got the regs book and started reading it I was totally confused by what tags I could buy, it is very hard to understand.
Is one person shooting 4 bucks good for your deer management??? I would rather shoot a doe than a small buck and then later have a chance at him once he's grown up.
As far as taking advantage of the system, it doesn't matter what it is, there are always going to be those people out there that find some loop hole and use it to their advantage.
 
I certainly agree with every one on making it simpler. I think part of the problem IS the party hunting and that is why PUPSTER'S friend can't buy a doe tag for 2nd gun season. That opens lots of potential abuse. I do think that he should be able to get a doe tag for late muzzle season how ever.

Thanks Ghost it is always nice to know some one actually reads this even when I don't piss them off.
 
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Does this sound right? Friend bowhunts and shotgun season one. Shoots buck with bow, has anysex tag for shotgun one that he fills with a doe, wants to go with me on Saturday for another doe but is told he can't buy anterless tag for shotgun two or late muzzleloader season. Has to wait for bonus season and the rifle season down south. He could have bought extra anterless tags for shotgun one but can't for second season?

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I was told that this was put in place to stop one group from "holding" a property for both seasons. If a group gets half anysex for season one, the other half gets anysex for season two, then those who don't have a anysex buy antlerless, they continue to party hunt the property both seasons. Thus, another group won't have access.
 
We'll call the guy an acquaintance, but anyhow He'll potentially shoot 6 bucks this year all perfectly legal.

1 with a bow

4 during shotgun 1 even though he only bought a doe tag.

1 with a late muzzle

Pupster
 
Ghost, I'm with you on making the options more clear!
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I just got done reading the rule book.
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If it wasn't for a buddy of mine i would not know i could go late muzz by going doe only for 1st shotgun.
 
To touch on the party hunting issue a bit...

Blaster touched on what I am going to say. What is the difference if you have 10 different hunters that shoot 10 bucks or if you have 2 out of the 10 that shoot all of the bucks? In this instance, 10 tags=10 bucks. I guess I don't see why, as some have put it, why the guy who shoots multiple bucks is unethical or morally wrong?? That's what party hunting is. I just don't see the stance on that. A tag is a tag and as long as it's 100% legal, does it matter WHO fills it?

If you are against party hunting, that's fine and I can understand that. But don't fault the guy that hunts within the rules and does what he needs to be legal. Do some think that if one shoots more than 1 buck, he's taking something from YOU? A deer is state property until it's shot, then it's yours.

Just my thoughts I guess.
 
Xtech Shooter,

This guy bought a doe tag (antlerless tag) which enabled him to party hunt 1st season. He shot 4 bucks and no one ever filled the doe tag.

I personally don't have a problem with party hunting.

The objective is to get does thinned out.

The topic of this thread is WORKING THE SYSTEM which is exactly what he did.

Pupster
 
I don't know your hunting rules/regs to the T being that I'm not from there and have only hunted there one season, but in the rules and regs of the IADNR...whether in some eyes he's WORKING THE SYSTEM or not, isn't he still "party hunting" and 100% legal?? If I'm wrong, please correct me.

Obviously it's my opionion and apparently one of the few that feel this way, but blame the state or the powers that be for the rules it/they came up with...not the hunter.
 
Yep, you're exactly right it's all perfectly legal.

It's the doe tag (that is designed to reduce the doe and deer herd and actually get wrapped around a does leg) isn't necessarily getting used for that reason and that's too bad.

Pupster
 
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