Clover

[dbltree]

May 2nd, 2011

The white clover is now lush and growing well and deer are grazing it heavily at this point. I rarely have to fertilize my clover other then at seeding but if yours is not thriving 200-400#'s of a low N fertilizer such as 6-24-24 and 400#'s of pellet lime will likely get your clover back on track.

The cool season grasses try to invade this time of year but they can be easily wiped out with 8 ounces of clethodim and 1 quart of crop oil per acre. Another option is a very lite dose of 41% glyphosate at 1 pint or less per acre.

Remember you don't need 40 acres of white clover, plant odd areas, field borders, apple orchards etc. and manage those smaller areas well. If you are constantly mowing your clover, that's a good indication you have far more then what deer can eat.

Welter Seed has a great selection of clover seeds and will sell it by the pound

Clover seed

You can also check AMPAC for dealers like Welters in your area

AMPAC Seed

Here's an online source for clethodim

Clethodim grass selective herbicide source

Crop oil should be available at your local co-op but if not...here's an online source

Crop Oil

If you have problems with broadleaf weeds and don't have chicory mixed in, try some Butyrac 200 (2-4DB)

Butyrac 200 Herbicide

Avoid less effective yet more expensive herbicides like Poast, Arrest and Slay (Slay is the same as Butyrac but far more expensive on a per acre basis). Always check locally for all your seed and herbicide needs but there are those across the country who do not live in ag country and having an online source comes in handy...

 

[KSQ2]

Dbltree, do you know of any sources to purchase berseem clover in smaller quantities? Welters has it listed in 50 lb. bags. Do they sell in bulk? I think next year I'll be getting some for soil improvement purposes.

 

[dbltree]

Dbltree, do you know of any sources to purchase berseem clover in smaller quantities? Welters has it listed in 50 lb. bags. Do they sell in bulk? I think next year I'll be getting some for soil improvement purposes.

They sell all clover, alfalfa and brassica seeds in any amount, just call and tell them how many pounds of berseem you need and they'll fix you up...:way:

 

[KSQ2]

Dbltree, our clover is up and looking good, but I'm finding out where I got my poison ivy weeks ago. There's quite a bit coming up in the plot, and I was wondering if I could put some 2-4d on it before it really got going. I know I'll kill some clover right around the ivy, but I think I'm willing to sacrifice a little to kill the ivy out. What do you think?

 

[dbltree]

Dbltree, our clover is up and looking good, but I'm finding out where I got my poison ivy weeks ago. There's quite a bit coming up in the plot, and I was wondering if I could put some 2-4d on it before it really got going. I know I'll kill some clover right around the ivy, but I think I'm willing to sacrifice a little to kill the ivy out. What do you think?

I would mow the PI because 2-4D is death on clover...later on use a low dose of glyphosate on the PI rather then 2-4D...

 

[KSQ2]

Will mowing put a halt to the poison ivy growth, it won't spread at ground level? If so, that sounds good to me, I'd rather not even spot spray the 2-4d if I can avoid it.

 

[dbltree]

Will mowing put a halt to the poison ivy growth, it won't spread at ground level? If so, that sounds good to me, I'd rather not even spot spray the 2-4d if I can avoid it.

Probably not...that stuff is very invasive but mowing might at least control it until the clover is able to dominate and suffocate it on it's own.

 

[dbltree]

When I was spraying full strength glyphosate (2 quarts per acre) on a field to prepare for RR soybeans, I swung a boom over a strip of white clover just for kicks....burned it pretty good so I'm observing it to see how well it comes back?

Meanwhile sprayed some Alice white clover with clethodim to nip some invading grasses in the bud and my gosh is that clover thick!

You can see why one needs only small areas of white clover because a little goes along long way!

This is an old pasture that has never been farmed so it does take a little work to keep the grasses at bay

We'll see what they look like in a couple weeks...I ran out with a bit left to do in the center

White clover is an important tool in our food plot arsenal but no need for 10 acres of it! This 1/4 patch is part of 5 acres of strip plots where brassicas, cereal grains and no soybeans make up the rest of the plots.

I have some Alice white clover I need to kill in a RR soybean field....might prove challenging, although I would be happy to just set it back and not actually kill it at all....

 

[dbltree]

May 26th, 2011

I sprayed 8 ounces of clethodim and 8 ounces of a concentrated crop oil on some white clover about 10 days ago. I sprayed along the edge of some winter rye and you can see how easily it's killed by the clethodim.

The rye was heading out so pretty tall and mature yet clearly the clethodim easily nuked it.

In the clover itself the grasses are dead as a door nail!

For less then 5 bucks an acre clethodim is by far one of the most effective yet least expensive grass selective herbicides safe on nearly all broadleaf plants!

Last summer I shared pictures of tilling under beautiful white clover for cereal grains...something that raised a few eyebrows although the cost to establish white clover is minimal at best. This is that same clover now....despite being tilled under it rebounded and is thriving along with the winter rye planted last fall.

I added some red clover with the rye/oats/peas and radish

but most of the clover is thicker then ever white clover, returned as though seeded a purpose!

It doesn't work the same way with brassicas because they are so thick the canopy shades out the clovers and they rarely return. In corn, soybeans and cereal grains however, disced or tilled under white clover will often reappear the following spring unless purposely killed with 2-4D or high doses of glyphosate and crop oil.....

 

[Skinny10]

Hello, been following all the different threads for a while now, I'm addicted I think.

I was wondering if Butyrac 200 would take care of burdock in our clover plots, the label said cocklebur on there, but after looking up pictures of both, we definately have a burdock problem.

 

[dbltree]

Hello, been following all the different threads for a while now, I'm addicted I think.

I was wondering if Butyrac 200 would take care of burdock in our clover plots, the label said cockle bur on there, but after looking up pictures of both, we definitely have a burdock problem.

I think it would depend on the size of the plant but I believe if small enough it would kill it. You can also use a very light does of roundup (1 pint per acre) to kill tough broadleaf plants in clovers, it will burn the clover but not kill it...

 

[risto2351]

Paul,

I helped a buddy put in a clover, oasis chicory plot this spring.

I looked at it yesterday and the chicory is coming in fine but with the
cold spring I do not see much clover. There is a lot of grass.

Should he spray with clethodim (I assume clethodim it is okay for chicory) or should he
just let the grasses grow and clip them. They are pretty thick.

Maybe start over?

Thank you.

 

[dbltree]

Paul,

I helped a buddy put in a clover, oasis chicory plot this spring.

I looked at it yesterday and the chicory is coming in fine but with the
cold spring I do not see much clover. There is a lot of grass.

Should he spray with clethodim (I assume clethodim it is okay for chicory) or should he
just let the grasses grow and clip them. They are pretty thick.

Maybe start over?

Thank you.

I would spray with clethodim and clean it up Tony (it's safe on all broadleaves including chicory), the clover may yet take off ?

Whenever possible, fall seed clover with rye to avoid weed problems in the future...

 

[risto2351]

I would spray with clethodim and clean it up Tony (it's safe on all broadleaves including chicory), the clover may yet take off ?

Whenever possible, fall seed clover with rye to avoid weed problems in the future...

Thanks Paul,

I agree on the fall seedings.

I think the main problem was the cool spring.

This was actually frost seeded on a dirt bed.

I replanted a old clover plot a couple of weeks ago and with the
rain and warmer weather it is doing awesome.

Will the Clethodim hurt the younger clover and chicory?

Thank you.

 

[hornhntr]

"Dbltree, I have a Alice White clover field now, can i just rototill it up and seed winter rye or do i have to kill it? Will the clover come back or do I need to seed more clover with the rye? Thanks

 

[dbltree]

Will the Clethodim hurt the younger clover and chicory?

Nope..

"Dbltree, I have a Alice White clover field now, can i just rototill it up and seed winter rye or do i have to kill it? Will the clover come back or do I need to seed more clover with the rye? Thanks

Nope...don't have to kill it and that's the beauty of it! It will return the following spring! Check the cereal grain thread for more info...:way:

 

[KSQ2]

Dbltree, I'm officially sold on small clover plots, I should have started doing this three years ago! Oh well, here's a question for you. I plan to put in another plot this fall, about a quarter acre. I haven't been too happy with the performance of our drill lately, especially on uneven ground. Could I work the ground well, and broadcast the winter rye, prior to broadcasting the alice clover? If so, what should I cover the rye with before the initial cultipacking for clover? Will just an old harrow cover it sufficiently? Or should I disk lightly? If disking, how light?
One more question, the plot will be in virgin ground that will have been sprayed with gly, several weeks earlier. I'll be applying pell lime. Should I add some nitrogen, for the rye, to the p&k I will be adding? (I get all my fertilizer from the coop and apply it one at a time.) Thanks!

 

[dbltree]

Dbltree, I'm officially sold on small clover plots, I should have started doing this three years ago! Oh well, here's a question for you. I plan to put in another plot this fall, about a quarter acre. I haven't been too happy with the performance of our drill lately, especially on uneven ground.

Could I work the ground well, and broadcast the winter rye, prior to broadcasting the Alice clover?

That's what I always do

If so, what should I cover the rye with before the initial cultipacking for clover? Will just an old harrow cover it sufficiently? Or should I disk lightly? If disking, how light?

I usually just broadcast the large seeds like cereals and peas and then just cultipack to cover or lightly till/disc/drag then in and then cultipack but usually if the soil is loose and dry, just broadcast the seeds and cultipack. Don't cover seeds more then an inch deep

One more question, the plot will be in virgin ground that will have been sprayed with gly, several weeks earlier. I'll be applying pell lime.

Should I add some nitrogen, for the rye, to the p&k I will be adding? (I get all my fertilizer from the coop and apply it one at a time.)

The rye will be higher quality and a more lush, attractive food source with nitrogen added, anywhere from 50-200#'s of urea depending on soil quality and budget...

 

[dbltree]

June 26th, 2011

Folks often ask "what can I plant in areas that sustain flooding"...not many crops can tolerate being under water for any length of time but white clover apparently can! This pictures tell a story of not only how much water clover can take but the kind of serious flooding we have endured in SE Iowa, not only this year but for four years running!

June 6th the clover got clipped

Deer use the field heavily and returned immediately although you can see the area was already "muddy" from previous heavy rains

June 14th the water rose to a level that didn't cover the tops of the clover but no doubt the root systems were "waterlogged" to say the least.

June 20th the entire field is underwater

This picture really gives you an idea how deep the water was!

June 23rd I went in to spray the clover with clethodim and although it was still soggy I had no idea the whole place had been a lake a few days earlier.

We have had repeated heavy rainfall events with 5-6" of rain on saturated soils, often only a week to 10 days apart so this field has endured flooding not only this year but repeatedly in past years, yet the clover appears to be thriving. It was planted by a previous landowner so I do not know the variety...only that it can stand being under water!

All of my white clovers have thrived the past few years thanks to cool wet weather and much of it on waterlogged soils. Seedling clovers will drown during establishment but established white and most red clovers love cool wet soils versus hot dry soil/weather.

If you have a spot that floods every now and then I would consider establishing white clover there by planting in late August with winter rye when weather is historically at it's driest. It's one crop I can honestly say will probably survive being under water for a day or so....

 

[dbltree]

I'm a firm believer in having white clover as a part of any given food plot even if it's only a small strip or edge because clover is capable of feeding a tremendous amount of deer almost year a round. Time after time I see landowners with wasted areas in a field and crops growing that only feed deer for a few months out of the year and simply converting those areas to clovers (if the soil and climate allow for it) can assure us that deer will be attracted to that feeding area year around, eventually becoming adapted to feeding only there.

These are pictures of odd areas around destination plot that will be yearly rotated between corn and beans...great crops that are very effective in attracting whitetails but...only providing feed for a portion of the year. Adding white clover will help us start to fill in the missing links to keeping them coming...every day, year around....

I sprayed the areas with glyphosate to kill cool season grasses and blackberries and shrubs that had invaded

and then cleared the place with a brush cutter

Narrow "edge" areas that have been in brome are perfect places to establish lush white clover without taking away from the original plot area. We'll start the white clover in late August with a rye/oats/pea planting and I'll share pictures as we get the area converted and fully used with a combination of food sources to attract and hold deer year around.

Odd areas can of course be used for other food sources such as apple trees, oaks and chestnuts and we have already added those to this feeding area....one that will eventually have every deer in the area visiting it on a daily basis....